soldano Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 I upgraded from my GForce 1060 6 GB to a RTX 3060 12 GB videocard, which is supposed to almost double its performance. My results are really dissapointing, as I didnt experience any improvement, but instead also a slightly worse FPM rate of about 5%.- I tried with the last Nvidia driver using the same settings as before.- The only diference is that the Developer performance window, shows no more the "limited by GPU" leyend which was common before, red sectors at the GPU line are completely gone, and now only shows "limited by main thread" constantly.- The system memory usage is not more than 70% (I have 24 GB RAM) and the video memory usage doesnt exceed 6 Gb. - I use medium to high graphic settings at MSFS. My CPU is an i7 990X overclocked to 4,5 Ghz (old but reliable),- So I am very surprised and angry for spending about $ 900 for nothing.- Any opinions ? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g7rta Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 What make if card is it? I presume it’s genuine? I don’t know much about the 3060 and what to expect, but it doesn’t sound right to me. Regards Steve Intel I9-13900K - Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite AX - 64Gb DDR5 5600Mhz - Asus RTX4090 ROG STRIX 24GB 3x 43” Panasonic 4k TVs - Corsair RMx 1200W PSU - 2 x 2TB M.2, 2 x 4TB SATA III and 1 x 4TB M.2 SSDs. Pico 4 VR Headset - Honeycomb Alpha Yoke - Honeycomb Bravo Throttle Unit Thrustmaster TPR Rudder Pedals - Saitek Throttles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldano Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 It is a EVGA card and got it into its sealed box and seems genuine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicS Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 I upgraded from my GForce 1060 6 GB to a RTX 3060 12 GB videocard, which is supposed to almost double its performance. My results are really dissapointing, as I didnt experience any improvement, but instead also a slightly worse FPM rate of about 5%.- I tried with the last Nvidia driver using the same settings as before.- The only diference is that the Developer performance window, shows no more the "limited by GPU" leyend which was common before, red sectors at the GPU line are completely gone, and now only shows "limited by main thread" constantly.- The system memory usage is not more than 70% (I have 24 GB RAM) and the video memory usage doesnt exceed 6 Gb. - I use medium to high graphic settings at MSFS. My CPU is an i7 990X overclocked to 4,5 Ghz (old but reliable),- So I am very surprised and angry for spending about $ 900 for nothing.- Any opinions ? Thanks Hi Jorge, I have a feeling it's because your venerable i7 simply can't supply your GPU with enough data/bandwidth. Whilst the 3060 is a much faster GPU than the 1060, the truth is...it's just not being worked by the CPU. In its time it was a great chip, but core technology has moved on substantially since then. Even a budget chip from today would (sorry to say) run rings around the i7 990X: https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-X-990-vs-Intel-Core-i5-9400F/m2590vs4051 https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/features/microsoft-flight-simulator-benchmarks-performance-system-requirements Hope this helps. Regards Dominic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daspinall Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 the thing is with GPU's to get the full performance you have to overclock, i learned that lesson thanks to MSFS2020 and I believe the performance details on the box is not the standard performance set at the factory but the overclocked performance..... My gpu would not run the sim with factory settings it produced lots of issues.... Once i overlocked the gpu it eats msfs2020 with no issues at all..... always make sure you have the latest GPU BIOS and drivers...... ASRock X570 TAICHI Mother Board AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.79 GHz *Overclocked* Corsair 240mm H100i ELITE CAPELLIX RGB Intel/AMD CPU Liquid Cooler Corsair DOMINATOR PLATINUM RGB 64GB 3600MHz *Overclocked* MSI NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Ti 24GB SUPRIM X Ampere. 1000W PSU. Samsung 870 EVO 2TB SSD. HP Reverb G2 + Oculus Quest 2 Samsung Odyssey G9 C49G95TSSR - QLED monitor - curved - 49" - 5120 x 1440 Dual Quad HD @ 240 Hz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plainsman Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Also, you are running DDR3 instead of DDR4 memory. This may be a bottleneck as well. I7-9700K, RTX-2070, Asus Strix Z-390-H MB, 32gb G Skill 3000 CL15, Corsair Obsidian 750D case, WD Black 1tb M.2, Crucial CT500MX SSD, Seasonic Prime 750W Titanium PSU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daspinall Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 I didn't see that, Yes! his ram is the weakest point in the main triangle CPU RAM GPU.... ASRock X570 TAICHI Mother Board AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.79 GHz *Overclocked* Corsair 240mm H100i ELITE CAPELLIX RGB Intel/AMD CPU Liquid Cooler Corsair DOMINATOR PLATINUM RGB 64GB 3600MHz *Overclocked* MSI NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Ti 24GB SUPRIM X Ampere. 1000W PSU. Samsung 870 EVO 2TB SSD. HP Reverb G2 + Oculus Quest 2 Samsung Odyssey G9 C49G95TSSR - QLED monitor - curved - 49" - 5120 x 1440 Dual Quad HD @ 240 Hz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldano Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 I am aware about my CPU limitations, but with the new GPU I expected at least some slight perfomance improvement, but I got just a slight worse perfomance, that is what surprises me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiloWatt Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) Is your power supply up to the job? I'm not at all sure about this, but what I'm getting at, is might the more powerful GPU be starving the CPU of power? Hence the slighly worse performance. I might be way off on this one, but worth looking into at least... Edit: Also - and maybe this is just too obvious, but you didn't change ANYTHING ELSE, right? Same resolution, same scaling, same everything. Just double check, perhaps the game reset some settings after it detected a change. Stranger things have happened. Edited June 30, 2021 by KiloWatt Ryzen 5 3600X, 16 GB 3733 MTs RAM, Radeon RX5700 OC, 2560 x 1080 Ultrawide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daspinall Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) I am aware about my CPU limitations, but with the new GPU I expected at least some slight perfomance improvement, but I got just a slight worse perfomance, that is what surprises me Like Plainsman pointed out, your ram needs to be DDR4, the DDR3 is most likely the root of your gpu problem. If you have the budget get 32gigs of Corsair Dominator they are a real real workhorse.... that alone will drastically improve the gpu performance...... Yor 3 main components need to complement each other in performance and speed. One weak link in the triangle cpu ram gpu and you're going to suffer performance loss, in your case your gps is suffering... Edited June 30, 2021 by daspinall ASRock X570 TAICHI Mother Board AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.79 GHz *Overclocked* Corsair 240mm H100i ELITE CAPELLIX RGB Intel/AMD CPU Liquid Cooler Corsair DOMINATOR PLATINUM RGB 64GB 3600MHz *Overclocked* MSI NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Ti 24GB SUPRIM X Ampere. 1000W PSU. Samsung 870 EVO 2TB SSD. HP Reverb G2 + Oculus Quest 2 Samsung Odyssey G9 C49G95TSSR - QLED monitor - curved - 49" - 5120 x 1440 Dual Quad HD @ 240 Hz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loki Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) Like Plainsman pointed out, your ram needs to be DDR4, the DDR3 is most likely the root of your gpu problem. If you have the budget get 32gigs of Corsair Dominator they are a real real workhorse.... that alone will drastically improve the gpu performance...... Yor 3 main components need to complement each other in performance and speed. One weak link in the triangle cpu ram gpu and you're going to suffer performance loss, in your case your gps is suffering... How is DDR4 going to help with their CPU? It's an old model and supports DDR3. As for the GPU, no, you should not need to overclock to get good performance. In this case upgrading the GPU likely just moved the bottleneck over to the CPU. One other possibility is whether they did a clean install of the GPU drivers. Edited June 30, 2021 by loki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicS Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 I am aware about my CPU limitations, but with the new GPU I expected at least some slight perfomance improvement, but I got just a slight worse perfomance, that is what surprises me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rooitou Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Yeah, I agree with the other guys about the CPU and possibly the RAM being bottlenecks. It's like putting a V8 in a Toyota Corolla. If you don't upgrade the chassis, gearbox, clutch and tyres at the same time, that Corolla is not going anywhere. Always best to keep motherboard, CPU, RAM and GPU within the same generation or two, otherwise they become bottlenecks. i5-10600K @ 5.0 GHz, Gigabyte Z490M motherboard, RTX 2080 Super 8GB, 64GB DDR4 3200MHz, ASUS ROG PG278Q 1440p monitor, CH Products Fighterstick, Pro Throttle and Pro Pedals, Track IR 5, Oculus Quest 2, Windows 10 64-bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daspinall Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) How is DDR4 going to help with their CPU? It's an old model and supports DDR3. As for the GPU, no, you should not need to overclock to get good performance. In this case upgrading the GPU likely just moved the bottleneck over to the CPU. One other possibility is whether they did a clean install of the GPU drivers. "As for the GPU, no, you should not need to overclock" I would have agreed with that a year a go.... however I learned this year if you don't overclock you have only factory setting, and not getting the full performance from the components.... My GPU will not run MSFS un-clocked in factory settings, I overclocked it and now it eats MSFS in ultra! and it's got the ram and cpu to back it up which are also clocked...... you don't see post from me on msfs crashing anymore...... there is no one stop solution for all because we all have different rigs and components..... Edited June 30, 2021 by daspinall ASRock X570 TAICHI Mother Board AMD Ryzen 9 3900X 3.79 GHz *Overclocked* Corsair 240mm H100i ELITE CAPELLIX RGB Intel/AMD CPU Liquid Cooler Corsair DOMINATOR PLATINUM RGB 64GB 3600MHz *Overclocked* MSI NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 Ti 24GB SUPRIM X Ampere. 1000W PSU. Samsung 870 EVO 2TB SSD. HP Reverb G2 + Oculus Quest 2 Samsung Odyssey G9 C49G95TSSR - QLED monitor - curved - 49" - 5120 x 1440 Dual Quad HD @ 240 Hz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Throttle_Up Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) I upgraded from my GForce 1060 6 GB to a RTX 3060 12 GB videocard, which is supposed to almost double its performance. My results are really dissapointing, as I didnt experience any improvement, but instead also a slightly worse FPM rate of about 5%.- My CPU is an i7 990X overclocked to 4,5 Ghz (old but reliable),- So I am very surprised and angry for spending about $ 900 for nothing.- Any opinions ? Thanks As other have pointed out - its your old CPU thats holding things back. I face the same issue - actually with the card you used to have. Im on an even weaker 13.7 year old system with i7 920 @ 3.8Ghz/12GB DDR2/GTX1060 6GB. Very happy with the card but the CPU is a roadblock. I'll just wait to get a new Win11 rig in about a year maybe. What make if card is it? I presume it’s genuine? I don’t know much about the 3060 and what to expect, but it doesn’t sound right to me. Regards Steve Its a well known card, Im considering it as well for a future rig. Easy to check with GPU-Z https://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/ Edited June 30, 2021 by Throttle_Up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patinthedesert Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 One comment and then a question. If the current system is running DDR3 on the main memory then the CPU and motherboard combo may not allow switch to DDR4, unless upgrading those parts as well. The question is about the power supply. You were going from a Gforce 1060 which did not require a direct connect to a GTX 3060 which definitely does need the power connector. What are you using for a power supply? IT may not be up to the job, although I would think it would crash if the power was inadequate. Pat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldano Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 Is your power supply up to the job? I'm not at all sure about this, but what I'm getting at, is might the more powerful GPU be starving the CPU of power? Hence the slighly worse performance. I might be way off on this one, but worth looking into at least... Edit: Also - and maybe this is just too obvious, but you didn't change ANYTHING ELSE, right? Same resolution, same scaling, same everything. Just double check, perhaps the game reset some settings after it detected a change. Stranger things have happened. I am using a certified PS of real 650 W. I made myself your same question, so I previously calculated the needed power with an aplication which calculates the power consumption of all the PC components, and the result was 500 W. I didnt change any setting either at the NVidia Panel or at the MSFS settings, and tried with several drivers. For that all is that I am surprised about the performance of the new Video Card, as I expected at least some slight improvement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldano Posted June 30, 2021 Author Share Posted June 30, 2021 I received some advices about playing with the MSFS graphics setting, raising that ones which are GPU dependant, and relaxing those which are CPU dependant, but I dont know which are they. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfojimbo Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 The i7 990X will only work with DDR-3 memory; but there is one possibility that might buy you some throughput. The i7 990X processor only requires 1066 mz memory which is almost the slowest DDR-3 memory made. If your installed memory is 1066, swapping it out with faster memory might make a difference since you say your CPU is overclocked. With faster memory, you might even be able to overclock it a bit more - if your motherboard will step up the memory timings along with overclocking. The only reason I suggest this is because DDR-3 memory is so cheap these days and you or someone you may know may have some DDR-3 1600 or 1866 gathering dust in a closet. If you do step up the processor throughput of your rig one way or another, please let us know how it affects MSFS performance. This is all very interesting. i7-10700K, ASUS Prime Z490-P motherboard, 32 gig, GTX 1080 Ti, 1TB M2 drive, Thrustmaster T16000M, Logitech Rudder Pedals , xbox controller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidc2 Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 If you do go the OC route on your CPU, you will need to monitor the heat that it will be putting out. In fact, it probably would not hurt to see how much you are putting out now. Just a thought :) Windows 10 Pro, 32 gigs DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GForce RTX 3070, Intel I7 10700 running at 3.8, with Noctua NH-L9x65, Premium Low-Profile CPU Cooler-HP Reverb G2 for Virtual Reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soldano Posted July 1, 2021 Author Share Posted July 1, 2021 The i7 990X will only work with DDR-3 memory; but there is one possibility that might buy you some throughput. The i7 990X processor only requires 1066 mz memory which is almost the slowest DDR-3 memory made. If your installed memory is 1066, swapping it out with faster memory might make a difference since you say your CPU is overclocked. With faster memory, you might even be able to overclock it a bit more - if your motherboard will step up the memory timings along with overclocking. The only reason I suggest this is because DDR-3 memory is so cheap these days and you or someone you may know may have some DDR-3 1600 or 1866 gathering dust in a closet. If you do step up the processor throughput of your rig one way or another, please let us know how it affects MSFS performance. This is all very interesting. I am using 24 Gb DDR3 1333 memory, at three 8 Gb channels, and can buy DDR3 1866 at good price here.- Do you think I can get some better performance ? is worth to get it ? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfojimbo Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 If the price is $20.00 or less it could be worth a try, but I wouldn't bet more than that on it. Look in your BIOS and see if there's a way to change memory timings; if so, it might be worth trying, if not, then it might just continue to run at 1066 even with the faster chips. If you can boost memory timings, you might be able to squeeze some performance from your 1333 chips before you spend anything. Your processor isn't a complete slouch, I would guess that you just have an unfortunate timing match between main memory and the 3060 clock rate. A 10% boost in memory speed might bring double the transfer rate. This is all a guess though. I don't think you need to lament the fact that you have DDR-3 memory especially if you can get it to run at 1866mz. When DDR-4 was announced a few years ago, it got fairly bad reviews, the techies didn't think it brought a very notable performance boost. i7-10700K, ASUS Prime Z490-P motherboard, 32 gig, GTX 1080 Ti, 1TB M2 drive, Thrustmaster T16000M, Logitech Rudder Pedals , xbox controller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NonCon Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 I suggest waiting until the next sim update later this month, which is suppose to provide a performance boost. After this you will have a clearer picture of where things stands as far as performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chicagorandy Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 In MY opinion, and the OP did ask for opinions, I have found it to be true that every 3-5 years a jumbo feature-packed latest and greatest new whiz-bang piece of amusement software is created that pretty much forces me to scrap my current desktop Windows PC and buy an upgraded one if I want to play said software. I did this with MSFS2020, along with buying 200mbps Xfinity servce, a yoke, throttle quadrant, rudder pedals and a head tracking rig to enhance my simulated flight experience. My truly 'budget' PC hardware allows me to enjoy MSFS at moderate levels of gameplay and that suffices.... for now -lol Asobo's creation is truly an amazing one and its sheer complexity is born out by how difficult it is to correct its minor flaws and also update and improve it on an ongoing basis. MSFS 2020 is not 'kind' to "old but reliable" hardware and about all I can do is stay within my limited budget and enjoy the game at the levels that budget presents. I heartily agree with the notion of a balanced 'trinity' of CPU/GPU/Internet Speed for best (for me) performance. FWIW I have NOT experienced a CTD or update issue to date.... knock wood. "Don't believe everything you see on the internet." - Abe Lincoln HP Pavilion Desktop i5-8400@2.8ghz, 16gb RAM, 1TB M.2 SSD, GTX1650 4GB, 300 MBPS internet, 31.5" curved monitor, Logitech yoke-throttle, Flt Vel trim wheel, TFRP rudder pedals, G/M IR headset, Extreme 3D Pro joystick, Wheel Stand Pro S Dlx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plainsman Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 I agree, it is time to go for a new PC, as your MB and processor can't support fast memory and probably fast storage as well. The good news is your new GPU could be installed and work well, in a new PC or you could probably sell it for a profit?? I have a few ideas on why your performance may have dropped. I suspect the new card by default installs with different settings in the Nvidea Controi Panel. It probably defaults to increased anisotropic filtering, antialiasing, CUDA cores used, texture filtering, FXAA and maybe even a different monitor recognition. Although your sim settings didn't change, Nvidea may have increased the quality in the background, commensurate with modern hardware expectations. What monitor are you running (resolution)? Your old GPU may not have recognized all the capability of your monitor? I7-9700K, RTX-2070, Asus Strix Z-390-H MB, 32gb G Skill 3000 CL15, Corsair Obsidian 750D case, WD Black 1tb M.2, Crucial CT500MX SSD, Seasonic Prime 750W Titanium PSU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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