Photographic Scenery Update

I have just read the KerrSpectives- "So what about the MSFS 2020 scenery"

I fully agree with everything he says, and would like to open up the subject, and find out why photographic scenery is not the accepted norm.

I have been a constant user of all versions of Flight Simulator for over 35 years since retiring from an aviation career, 8 years in the RAF from 1949 to 1957, and 35 years as an Airline Pilot.

I am now almost 89, and still enjoying the flight simulator, I do however prefer realism, having been used to it throughout my flying career !!

I have tried several scenery systems over the years, and finally settled with "Horizon VFR GEN X" and FSX. The only snags using a 30 bit system being the lack of clarity, and the inability to use it below about 2000 ft.

I reverted to P3D a couple of years ago, and really appreciated the improvement in clarity, due to a 64 bit system. the scenery is quite old now and would certainly benefit from an update. I am however very frustrated by the cost of keeping P3D updated.

So here we are with the latest innovation, Microsoft 2020. I eagerly read about the world wide scenery, and the mention that it would be possible to fly over ones own house.

I have not invested in MSFS 2020 because it is not realistic, and hope that I will live long enough to see something like GOOGLE EARTH become available.

My question to all developers is, what are the problems, and can they be overcome?

Many thanks, roytc

Hi Roy, I hope I’m still around and using flight sims when I get to your age :)

I used to use FSX with VFR scenery. All those addons get expensive don’t they? I always disabled autogen & simply used the vfr scenery. Flying around the UK was brilliant, although I often suffered from blurry tiles & shimmering graphics, even with a high end pc.

However, although for the MSFS scenery is based on Bing maps rather than google maps (which I would have preferred) it is still absolutely stunning! I’ve never seen flight simulator scenery like it.

I presume you will have seen the various YouTube videos showing it? I really recommend you take a look. Some of the buildings are unrealistic but it’s still so much better than we’ve ever had before.

Regards

Steve

I have just read the KerrSpectives- "So what about the MSFS 2020 scenery"

I fully agree with everything he says, and would like to open up the subject, and find out why photographic scenery is not the accepted norm.

I have been a constant user of all versions of Flight Simulator for over 35 years since retiring from an aviation career, 8 years in the RAF from 1949 to 1957, and 35 years as an Airline Pilot.

I am now almost 89, and still enjoying the flight simulator, I do however prefer realism, having been used to it throughout my flying career !!

I have tried several scenery systems over the years, and finally settled with "Horizon VFR GEN X" and FSX. The only snags using a 30 bit system being the lack of clarity, and the inability to use it below about 2000 ft.

I reverted to P3D a couple of years ago, and really appreciated the improvement in clarity, due to a 64 bit system. the scenery is quite old now and would certainly benefit from an update. I am however very frustrated by the cost of keeping P3D updated.

So here we are with the latest innovation, Microsoft 2020. I eagerly read about the world wide scenery, and the mention that it would be possible to fly over ones own house.

I have not invested in MSFS 2020 because it is not realistic, and hope that I will live long enough to see something like GOOGLE EARTH become available.

My question to all developers is, what are the problems, and can they be overcome?

 

Many thanks, roytc

Hi Roy, I also look upon you and hope to be simming at 89

I agree with you that scenery is not the same as Google earth, to me one thing that ruins it is autogen, although it has improved a lot from fsx

MSFS scenery is much better than any scenery of other sims. At least that.

And you can install freeware handcrafted scenery that is growing by the day. +500 landmark or scenery as of today. Imagine in a year, there will be large cities all compiled with corrected landmarks and buildings

Competition is a healthy reality that benefits us

Xplane 11.5 is still in the race

If Xplane manages a deal with google I think I will be running both sims until I chose one that takes the lead. If I were Austin I would be sleeping at Google s door. Its his shortcut to victory

I'm a bit of a kindred spirit here, I've been tinkering since FS98 too and I always preferred VFR scenery as well.

I progressed through FSX, then P3D and am now using xplane 11.5 and FS2020.

Yes, add-on VFR scenery was quite expensive, even just for limited areas like just the UK. I had all the versions of Horizon Gen X, and tried other add-ons that added autogen trees too, (very unrealistic though, they were completely out of scale !). :rolleyes:

There is a quite good VFR scenery alternative to FS2020's scenery now though, something called "Ortho4XP", which I use currently with xplane. Quite surprisingly, it's completely free too, though the process of creating the "tiles" oneself from online imagery such as Bing or Google Earth needs patience and careful following of the instructions.

It's actually more accurate visually than FS2020, because there is no autogen so the buildings and vegetation are exact, but lacking in 3D height. It poses an interesting choice for me, when flying in XP or FS.

I've attached two screenshots of a village near me, Wroxham, in Norfolk, taken from 800ft.

The FS2020 version (c172 - ASXGS) is running at "Ultra" and shows great detail and perspective in the buildings, and they and the water are in the right positions, but they bear little relation to the style of the real buildings, and the bridge is missing.

By comparison, the XP11 version (c172 - N172SP), running also at max resolution and using Ortho4xp scenery at 19 res, shows the buildings absolutely correctly, and the bridge, though "flat", but that effect is less noticeable as you go up.

The quality of the uploaded images is slightly reduced as 80% jpeg's, to keep within the forum's upload size limit of 450k

Great comparison. My XPlane friends told me about ortho4xp

How does ortho4xp compares to MS in elevation terrain, when there are hills or mountains all over?

Anyway, Im not going into the fuss of downloading little corners of the world anymore

Ive been there in Tileproxy days

The greatness of MSFS is being able to fly around anywhere and the scenery just pops.

Im a guy that enjoys the surprise, the be-wilderness of choosing a place to fly and looking around, not having gone thru a tedious process of previously downloading tiles (which usually covers small spots) or take months to build large areas

Once you get used to it, you dont want to download tiles anymore.

As I said, XPlane needs a deal with google

Hi Roy, I also look upon you and hope to be simming at 89

I agree with you that scenery is not the same as Google earth, to me one thing that ruins it is autogen, although it has improved a lot from fsx

 

MSFS scenery is much better than any scenery of other sims. At least that.

And you can install freeware handcrafted scenery that is growing by the day. +500 landmark or scenery as of today. Imagine in a year, there will be large cities all compiled with corrected landmarks and buildings

 

Competition is a healthy reality that benefits us

Xplane 11.5 is still in the race

If Xplane manages a deal with google I think I will be running both sims until I chose one that takes the lead. If I were Austin I would be sleeping at Google s door. Its his shortcut to victory

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

As the saying goes, "I used to be undecided, but now I'm not so sure..."

Yes, FS2020 is great in that the whole world is already there, no need to download tiles. If one tried to do that with Ortho4xp, it would use hundreds or terrabytes of diskspace and take several years.

Thanks God for variety though, I use xplane with Ortho4xp in my most flown VFR areas, and now MS2020 for everything else.

They co-exist happily on my PC, and there's no such crime as software Bigamy..... :)

Another thing that dissapoints me about the current social media furore about FS is the way so many users feel they have to choose, and then defend their personal choice to the death.....

I see some reasons to chose

Its annoying and confusing having to get used to both keyboard settings and ways...

It takes time to have in your head the different shortcut for things, or even tweaking and file editing.

You will notice with time if you have both you ll end using mainly one.

When thinking "I could try this on the other sim", get lazy or quit early because forgotten keys or steps and that drains the energy for fun

Another reason are addons. Investing or learning. For trial or random flying two are bearable, when simming gets serious you want to tie the knot :)

God bless yah, 89! I want to let you know, the next update is coming out with in the next ten days, is to include a world update as well, which probably means scenery. Bear in mind, older photo scenery doesn't include trees, or anything really, so you're probably looking at a step back in visuals.

Just hang in there for the updates. We'll be impressed more and more each one.

My question to all developers is, what are the problems, and can they be overcome?

 

Many thanks, roytc

The biggest limitation with the method Asobo is using is the amount and quality of source data they have. Some areas have excellent photogrammetry, others have enough data that the AI process they are using can generate something reasonably close to the real world, and then many other areas fall somewhere outside of these. Bing has been updating their data more often in the past few years and, in some areas, is actually better than Google. As the source data is updated, the scenery will improve. On top of this, I'm sure they will be working on how objects in the scenery, like bridges, are generated. They have said their plan for the sim is to release feature updates to add new functionality to the sim, like helicopters, as well as scenery updates to update and improve the world outside the aircraft.