PhrogPhlyer

2 hours ago, Melo965 said:

They said we are welcome back anytime! 

Job well done!

I just successfully downloaded an FSX and MSFS aircraft using DuckDuckGo.

Previous download issues using Chrome or Edge have ceased once I switch to DuckDuckGo several months ago.

It is now the only browser I use.

52 minutes ago, loki said:

1GBps fibre internet connection

Well over half of NJ,, one of the most densely populated States, does not have access to fiber internet.

We're lucky to get a reasonable rate for 200 or 300GB speed through a cable provider, with no other option.

Wherever you are, consider yourself lucky to have such economical speeds.

1 minute ago, Rupert said:

I assume I'll miss the next one in 2044.

The runway seems to get shorter every year. 

Make each takeoff worth the effort.

3 hours ago, flapman said:

2D cockpits have their place,

For IFR training, where understanding the IFR environment is more important than accuracy of the sim presentation, the 2D panel is a much stronger training tool.

In reality, when in IMC conditions, your world is reduced to the panel in front of you.

And for the IFR student, developing good scan habits and observing the subtle movements and functioning of instrument presentation, again, I feel the 2D panel is superior.

This is not downplaying to wonderful full cockpit presentation of the VC, just one instructor's opinion for a specific need.

Yes, it is a shame that it did not get past the cutting table. 

I feel that this would have allowed MSFS to offer broader training capabilities, especially with its better visual realism when breaking out of the clouds at 200 & 1/4 on the approach.

1 hour ago, Lazerson said:

Helendale AAF Aux in California

Thank you, I'll include in the next rev!

2 hours ago, Rupert said:

so we could see the whole eclipse very well in French Lick In

We had a 90% eclipse in NJ, and was clear skies until right at peak eclipse,

I used the sun shades on my Plath sextant to view the partial eclipse.

21 minutes ago, Melo965 said:

The ramp is pretty empty so I must be the last one to leave after the party!

As a reward for being last in, we left the tab for you to pick up.

Don't forget a big tip to the party wait staff.

57 minutes ago, Airbasil_1 said:

(which in your mind, should be deleted immediately

I never made any such statement, nor did I say you should not post the Twin Towers.

My only point is to consider that we have people from all over the world, with all kinds of experiences and sensitivities.

jgf's example of the swastika is an excellent example. I too have it on many WWII aircraft, and personally do not display them here except with a historical context, such as if I showed Hanna  Reitsch flying the Focke-Achgelis Fa 61 inside the Deutschlandhalle. There is no way to recreate that event in FS without the correct aircraft paint scheme.

3 hours ago, defaid said:

Crank up Hendrix Purple Haze in your headset, Excuse me while I kiss the sky!

2 hours ago, Sirrus said:

The fact that you choose to put these on a thread where there are people who lost friends and colleagues

I spent 6 months at the WTC pit during the clean-up. One of the most humbling and solemn periods of my life.

Should one wish to include them in screenshots, please be respectful and at least state that maybe the pics are older, or that one is intending to showcase the grandeur that is now lost.

4 hours ago, jgf said:

But there is room for everyone, I enjoy FS2004 as much as you enjoy MSFS, we both win.

I agree, just as I enjoy reading the threads of all sim versions here on FlightSim.

All sims have so much to offer.

And whichever gets you into the virtual skies is what matters most.

Happy Simming!

So, you want to be a Rotorhead...

Step 1 - Selecting your first helicopter.

Some thoughts when selecting a helicopter to focus on basic helicopter skills (ground maneuvers).

The biggest drawback to any PC based sim helicopter, compared to an actual helicopter, has nothing to do with the programing of flight dynamics, or the number or sophistication of gauges or autopilot/FMS, it is simply the lack of visual cues when looking outside the cockpit.

The helicopter pilot uses so many subtle visual cues for aircraft movement. When in the hover, while hover taxiing, when transitioning from the hover to forward flight, and when transitioning from forward flight to the landing, peripheral vision plays a predominant role in acquiring those movement cues.

With the sim, peripheral cues are all but non-existent. The best we can do is pan back while using the virtual cockpit (VC), accepting a loss of panel detail to gain more outside visual width.

So, starting with the premise of "the more outside view the better" let's take a look at a wide selection of available helicopters and discuss their plusses and minuses for outside visual primarily while in ground effect (IGE). When out of ground effect (OGE) or while in forward flight, just as in a fixed wing aircraft, ground visual references play less of a role and aircraft position in reference to the horizon takes the lead. The following pictures are to give you an idea of the broad differences that exist in cockpit visibility with several helicopters.

Let's first look at helicopters that are often used for primary flight training. These being the Bell 47, Hughes/Schweizer 300, and Robinson R-22.

One can clearly see that the B-47, H/S-300, and R-22 offer exceptional visibility due to their large amount of unobstructed plexiglass surrounding the pilot.

When we consider helicopters that are often used for intermediate/advanced flight training we look to the Bell 206 JetRanger and the Aérospatiale Alouette III.

Both these aircraft offer good visibility in addition to good VFR/IFR instrument panels.

The remainder of the examples are corporate, utility, or military helicopters with much less visibility, but with other strengths such as maneuverability, payload capacity, IFR and/or icing certification, or similar capabilities. Some have strong IFR panels with FMS and/or autopilot.

In sim flying these aircraft allow for flying various real-world scenarios (EMS, Combat, Firefighting) an flying to destination using the IFR route structure.

Agusta Westland EC135, Agusta Westland EH101, Bell H-1 Huey, Bell AH-1S Cobra, Bell 412, Eurocopter AS332, Eurocopter EC135, Hughes OH-6, and Silorsky S-55.

My recommendation is to initially fly smaller, less "capable" helicopters that favor good outside visibility. The less systems the better. And if it is perceived as a hard aircraft to hover, stick with it. If you can master ground reference maneuvers in this, anything else becomes easy. And don't worry about reciprocating vs turbine because, with very few exceptions, these will fly the same utilizing a governor to maintain rotor RPM with increase of power.

Note: My comments in this thread will be used in developing an article taking an in-depth look at sim helicopter flying for the beginner.

7 hours ago, taoftedal said:

"Any landing you walk away from ins a good one!

You are welcome.

Ask the question again in this forum, it should get more attention there,

Click Start a New Topic.

https://www.flightsim.com/forums/forum/179-msfs-2020-default-aircraft-discussion/

Glad you reached out for help.

What sim version and aircraft are you using?

We can then move this conversation to the appropriate thread and sort out your issue.

22 minutes ago, igami said:

One of the more interesting, COOL, paint schemes I've seen in a while. Well done.

1 hour ago, Sirrus said:

This ended up as

and

Capable of 387 knots at 33000 feet, and of flying from RAF Benson to Berlin and back.

Nicely done! Love the old UK blue/blue roundel.

https://www.worldwarphotos.info/gallery/uk/raf/spitfire2/spitfire-mk-xi-681-india-1945/

2 hours ago, ViperPilot2 said:

Maybe I should not have recommended it then.

Excellent recommendation, just not for initial training. In my opinion.

1 hour ago, TomPenDragon said:

If you're talking about the HoverControl training scenery, I think it's a good recommendation.  I'm really glad to see it survive here when so much of that great library seems to have been lost.  One does not need the scenery to learn whirlybirds; neither does one need to use the platforms and everything until they're ready.  If someone like PhrogPhlyer (how many rotary-wing hours do you have in your logbooks between RL and FS, Dick?) feels the need to practice basic maneuvers from time to time, it's probably a good idea to take his suggestion to not get ahead of ourselves.  If I want to relax and have fun (at this point in my flying journey), I'll grab something fixed-wing.  I'll only get in a helicopter now if I'm ready to work and learn.  Guess what?  It's like having a whole new sim, after two decades of FS2004.

Yes the HoverContol training scenery is good, and has its place, but not for initial training. It is in the medium skill level range.

I have around 2500 real RW hours and well in excess of that between FS2004 and FSX.

I'd say flying a helicopter is more like riding a unicycle while an airplane is a Harley or Indian.

So keeping up on basic skills is essential.

And I do love the overall view I get with a Bell-47 while sight seeing around the world.

Both RW and FW have their place, Just don't try to land a 747 in your new helo-pad.

ViperPilot2 said:

There's a great Helo Training Scenery for Nine that has a Tower with lots of elevated Platforms, Trailers on the Tarmac to land on, and various Helipads all over the area, along with the Hana Airport (PHHN) in Hawai'i. The folks at the now defunct HoverControl site created this Scenery for their Training program. 

I do remember having this loaded when I was running FS9.

It is a good add-on for helicopter training.

To all aspiring sim helicopter pilots, a word of caution, don't get ahead of yourself.

Consistency with basics, hovering, landing from a hover, small positional adjustments in the hover, air taxi, turns and side slides at low speed, all these mundane repetitive tasks are essential to be able to land with minimal visual cues.

Please, don't rush this critical part of your skill set.

Landing on various objects and platforms, on pinnacles and slopes, will make more sense and be much easier to master with these basic skills solidified.

Periodically I still go to Spence NOLF and fly basic ground maneuvers, hover turns, turns around the nose, turns around the tail, flying a square box taxi pattern, doing the same with constant heading, repeating the same IGO or OGE (in or out of ground effect). Without this practice, I can see my finer skills do diminish.

Flying a helicopter is more of a finessed art than flying a fixed-wing.

Remember, "Flying is heavenly, to hover divine."

Some of posts from the [ Club Chachapoya ] Meigs or Bust thread.

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  On 4/3/2024 at 6:58 AM, MAD1 said:

Why do helicopter pilots sit on the right?

My response:

Because it's the "right" thing to do!

Actually, it has to do with history, engineering and arm strength,

The collective was developed to give you mechanical advantage to lift the swash plate, long before hydraulic or electrical actuators were used.

So with the cyclic (the stick) in your right hand as with an airplane, and placing the collective close to directly under the center of rotation/swash plates (with some cables and pullies to adjust for actual seat position), you could pull up on the collective with your left hand/arm.

The Sikorsky R-4 had a single collective centered between the two seats, and again, the pilot with a normal cyclic position (in your right hand) became to PIC.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

ViperPilot2 posted

Courtesy of Sergeant Harley Rumbaugh:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A great source of info is Helisimmer.com

https://www.helisimmer.com/how-to-fly-helicopters

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On 4/3/2024 at 6:58 AM, MAD1 said:

Why do helicopter pilots sit on the right?

Ruperts respose:

It's because of the mechanics of the chopper.  The Collective (the lever on your left) raises and lowers all rotor blades the same amount by raising the stationary swash plate equally so it requires by far, the most leverage.  By setting the pilot on the right, the linkage from the collective lever is almost straight up to the swash plate making the extra leverage needed, more practical to apply. 

With all blades set at the same angle for a full rotation, the aircraft should hover. Having said that, a single main rotor aircraft would rotate in the opposite direction from the rotation of the main rotor because of the torque involved.  Thus at low speed or hover you need another force to prevent unwanted aircraft rotation.  On a single main rotor craft you often have a smaller side mounted tail rotor to cancel out the torque spin, 

However with a dual main rotor aircraft torque rotation isn't nearly so much of an issue because the main rotors rotate in opposite directions from each other so the torque reaction is cancelled out.

The Cyclic (what you might  call the joy stick) raises and lowers only parts of the swash plate(s) on the fore and aft planes and side planes to lessen or increase the blade pitch depending where the blades are in their rotation to make the aircraft go forward, aft, or sideways.  Since the Cyclic needs much less power to make these changes, the linkage doesn't need to be nearly as straight as that of the Collective. 

On a multiple main rotor aircraft you move the plane forward by using more rotor tilt on the aft rotor than the forward one and vice-versa.  Hover is with both rotors pulling equal load,  

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On 4/4/2024 at 2:50 PM, jgf said:

Throttle is the collective and stick the cyclic, rudder (pedals or twist grip) is the tail rotor

My response:

Absolutely correct.

For flight simming with a helicopter it is less important whether you have a throttle or collective, anti-torque (rudder) pedals or twist grip, or any of the various control peripherals that you can purchase, and more important that you move those controls SLOWLY and SMOOTHLY.

I recommend that you find someplace with good visual cues (straight lines are best) and lift slowly into a hover.

Pan back in VC to get the most visual width, and initially don't get hung up on RPM, torque or other details.

Just work on lifting into a low hover (3-5 ft.), maintaining the hover, landing from the hover and repeat.

Then progress to small forward, lateral, and back ward movements. Returning to the stable hover after each move.

Then slow air taxi in the area, returning to the stable hover, and landing.

Once you are relatively comfortable in the hover/hover taxi environment, then you can move onto translating to forward flight.

I suggest you do this on a long runway (the long straight visual cue helps).

Lift into a stable hover, apply slight forward cyclic (stick) and accelerate into forward flight.

Then slow down (apply back cyclic while decreasing power) and descend to a stable hover (add power as enter the hover.

Then land from the hover and repeat (longer the runway, the more times you can repeat.

After a few time back and forth down the runway, then take the helo around the pattern.

Airspeed will be the hardest thing to visualize, so ensure the airspeed indicator is visible.

I'm putting together a brief to include some pics that hopefully will help.

Do not get frustrated, none of us did well at this the first time, even with many real helo hours.

Good luck.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Spencer NOLF (NRQ) and KNDZ NAS Whiting (South) are good places to practice helo flying.

Check to see if there are any scenery enhancements for your sim version.

Here is Spencer with FSX addon scenery.

If you want NAS Whiting and Spencer NOLF here is the link:

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ViperPilot2 stated:

Try the Hover Gauge; it'll give you a whole appreciation for slow speed and Hover. With it I can put the Skids on the 'X' about 70% of the time. I have Bjorn Buchtner's Hughes 500D; it has lines in the Aircraft.cfg for Turboprop, Turbine AND Jet Engine parameters, while the Nemeth MD500E-G uses Turboprop Engine parameters!

Like I said... all over the map. I'll tell you; sitting there for an hour and a half hand flying a Helo with no Trim, AP or stick centering is an exercise in attentiveness, eyes glued to the VSI.

Since there appears to be some interest in helicopter flying within this group, I started a [ Club Chachapoya ] Rotorhead thread.

Let's move rotor only discussions to that thread. 

This thread is a continuation of discussions on sim helicopter flying for all sim versions. Please post questions, answers, ideas, link, complaints, suggestions, techniques, screenshots, whatever here. If it has a rotor, it belongs in this thread.

All comments concerning flight techniques, rules, airspace and similar, are intended for flight sim application only and are not for use in real flying. 

13 hours ago, ViperPilot2 said:

There's a great Helo Training Scenery for Nine that has a Tower with lots of elevated Platforms, Trailers on the Tarmac to land on, and various Helipads all over the area, along with the Hana Airport (PHHN) in Hawai'i. The folks at the now defunct HoverControl site created this Scenery for their Training program. 

I do remember having this loaded when I was running FS9.

It is a good add-on for helicopter training.

To all aspiring sim helicopter pilots, a word of caution, don't get ahead of yourself.

Consistency with basics, hovering, landing from a hover, small positional adjustments in the hover, air taxi, turns and side slides at low speed, all these mundane repetitive tasks are essential to be able to land with minimal visual cues.

Please, don't rush this critical part of your skill set.

Landing on various objects and platforms, on pinnacles and slopes, will make more sense and be much easier to master with these basic skills solidified.

Periodically I still go to Spence NOLF and fly basic ground maneuvers, hover turns, turns around the nose, turns around the tail, flying a square box taxi pattern, doing the same with constant heading, repeating the same IGO or OGE (in or out of ground effect). Without this practice, I can see my finer skills do diminish.

Flying a helicopter is more of a finessed art than flying a fixed-wing.

Remember, "Flying is heavenly, to hover divine."