Climb rate unpressurised aircraft

[nsproles]

I often see in articles, unpressurised aircraft being flown with  climb and descent rates in excess of 1000 fpm.  I also have read that anything over 500 fpm in an unpressurized aircraft can be most uncomfortable for passengers and crew.  For example,  the cabin altitude in the pressurised TBM 930 is limited to 500 fpm which reinforces this opinion.  Taking off in a C 172 or G 36 Bonanza in MSFS, but limiting the rate of climb to 500 fpm, means that you seem to be going a long way horizontally but nowhere much vertically.  Do other simmers bear crew and passenger comfort in mind when taking off and landing in unpressurised aircraft and limit their rates of climb and descent to 500 fpm or thereabouts?

[JSkorna]

My crew and passengers don't have feelings so I fly however I want, sometimes upside down.

[PhrogPhlyer]

In pressurized aircraft you can adjust cabin rate of climb so that even if the aircraft is climbing at a high rate you can maintain a comfortable rate for the passengers. Just watch that you stay at or below maximum pressure differential. 

[nsproles]

9 hours ago, PhrogPhlyer said:

In pressurized aircraft you can adjust cabin rate of climb so that even if the aircraft is climbing at a high rate you can maintain a comfortable rate for the passengers. Just watch that you stay at or below maximum pressure differential. 

Yes, I am aware of this, but my question is about flying unpressurised aircraft like the C152, C172 and G36 Bonanza.

[PhrogPhlyer]

The C-150 has a SL best rate of climb of around 670 fpm, and the C-152 around 715 fpm. A C-172 is around 730 fpm. A G-36 around 1250 fpm.

All in all, most single engine aircraft should not be uncomfortable for your passengers even at best rate of climb.

 

Here is a good article on benefits of Vcc (cruise climb speed) to the overall flight.

https://www.boldmethod.com/learn-to-fly/performance/what-is-cruise-climb-and-when-should-you-use-it-in-your-climb/

 

[lnuss]

20 hours ago, nsproles said:

I also have read that anything over 500 fpm in an unpressurized aircraft can be most uncomfortable for passengers and crew.  For example,  the cabin altitude in the pressurised TBM 930 is limited to 500 fpm which reinforces this opinion.  Taking off in a C 172 or G 36 Bonanza in MSFS, but limiting the rate of climb to 500 fpm, means that you seem to be going a long way horizontally but nowhere much vertically. 

Keep in mind that it's rare than you CAN climb much over 600-700 fpm in a C-172 and much over 1200 fpm in a Bonanza, and that cruise altitudes for these aircraft are mostly under 10,000 feet above sea level. But it's very true that most inexperienced people have ear problems (pressure build-up or deficit) at rates much past 500 fpm. But most pilots learn to clear their ears more quickly and more frequently than most others learn to do.

 

Some pilots (myself included) can tolerate rates of descent well over 2000 fpm, but it takes special technique.

"going a long way horizontally but nowhere much vertically."

Your destination isn't all that high, in most cases, but you certainly WANT to go a long ways horizontally, so it's well matched.

In the real world (in the sim, do what you want) most of us do, indeed, bear passenger comfort in mind, and while higher climb rates are possible in many aircraft, you do sacrifice horizontal distance over time (i.e. speed) to get a faster rate of climb, and the goal is usually to get to the destination more quickly.

 

So what's the actual problem? Seems well matched to me.

[ScottishMike]

I don't worry too much about the climb rate, it's the decent rate that can get fast and dangerous ;-). During my pilot training the instructor took me through stalls and spins inducing them then showing recovery then asking me to do the same. As a passanger I soon became very queasy, yet when pilot in command the manouvers induced no sickness.

Also at much above 8500' in an unpressurized aircraft I tend to get a blinding headache (I don't tolerate altitude very well). The rate of climb never seemed to bother me.

[nsproles]

1 hour ago, ScottishMike said:

Also at much above 8500' in an unpressurized aircraft I tend to get a blinding headache (I don't tolerate altitude very well). 

You might like to have a look at this article;  Altitude Headache: Signs, Causes, Treatment, Acclimating (verywellhealth.com)

[PhrogPhlyer]

2 hours ago, ScottishMike said:

As a passanger I soon became very queasy, yet when pilot in command the manouvers induced no sickness.

This is not uncommon. When you are actually in control of the aircraft, your mind is busy with many thing that may keep focus off of physiological sensations. As a passenger, or student not at the controls, you worry and focus on many other things, especially your own sensations. This also occurs with sea and car sickness.

[nsproles]

On 7/12/2023 at 1:25 AM, ScottishMike said:

. As a passanger I soon became very queasy, yet when pilot in command the manouvers induced no sickness.

I was a passenger in a Cessna 180 flying for extensive periods of time over water at 1500ft on a very bumpy day.  My stomach was quesy but I gritted my teeth and carried on with the job.  It was with great relief that I heard the pilot say that he was going in to land as he was about to get sick.  I only outlasted him by a few minutes but was proud not to have been the first to crack.

[Hyperdark]

Quote

Some pilots (myself included) can tolerate rates of descent well over 2000 fpm, but it takes special technique.

 

 

Rubbish, 2000fpm is quite ok for most people without any prior "special technique" some harmless ear popping might be experienced

It can't have been any different when you used to fly a lot, but I guess it reinforces the Skygod image old pilots seem to want to impress on others

 

 

 

How fast do you reckon a novice tandem skydive participant descends? and what special techniques do you imagine they are taught before dropping from 14k?

 

 I am current in high performance un pressurised aircraft and did my first  freefall jump from 14k, not a google 'expert' in case you were wondering