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Runway usage at O'Hare?


TheRedBadger

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This has always been a question I've had. On the sim, only two runways are ever used at a time (two parallel), but that just seems... very inefficient and simple for the busiest airport in the world in terms of aircraft movements. I've tried looking at flightaware to observe which runways are in use at a time, but I can't seem to draw out the traffic patterns. How have y'all modified your O'Hare (default) airports to have more of those runways in use? I doubt they only ever use 2 at a time (or heck, maybe they do and things back up like in JFK). Are crosswinds really that big a deal for taking off? Airplanes in giant airports like Heathrow have to deal with it anyways.

 

In real life, I believe there are now 4 parallel runways at O'Hare (with a fifth one under construction), so that could also be an alternative for me; create more of those runways (once I learn how to do so). Although O'Hare would be drastically slow if crosswinds happen, diverting traffic to the "crosswind runways". DFW has two of them, but I don't recall they've ever been used when I fly there.

 

It also seems unlikely (and unsafe) to have all 6 intersecting runways to be used at the same time.

Carlos Si
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For real world observation look here at busy times:

 

http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KORD .

Click on the icon with the orange icon with the four crossed arrows for a full window. Your mouse wheel can scroll the zoom level and you can drag with the left arrow the view position. Note the mileage scale in black on the lower left of the map. If you zoom close enough you might tell what runway an aircraft is landing on. On the first page before going full screen if you scroll down on the right side you'll get to the current METAR. Aircraft in blue are arriving and green are departing. Each info box contains the flight identification, aircraft type, altitude (in 100's of feet), ground speed. Clicking on an aircraft will take you to a map of the filed plan and flight data for time, altitude requested, etc., scheduled and actual departure and arrival times, and a description of the aircraft. Pink aircraft are flying through that airspace without stopping there.

 

Clicking on an IFR tab can get you bundled and single .pdf charts of all procedures plus an airport diagram.

 

http://www.liveatc.net/feedindex.php?type=all and enter the ICAO code in the search box. You then get a list of the communications available including ATIS if present that you can select for monitoring.

 

Here's what I suggest for monitoring in FSX or FS9. Install the latest version of FSUIPC (3 for FS9, 4 for FSX and Steam FSX) from:

 

http://forum.simflight.com/topic/66139-updated-modules/

full and interim as needed. You will not need a paid user registration. The download is an .exe that will self install.

 

Now go here:

 

http://forum.simflight.com/topic/66136-useful-additional-programs/

 

and download the zip of Traffic Look. Extract that to any folder you wish. Traffic Look runs in its own window. Park an aircraft at you airport of interest at a busy time, then start Traffic Look. A descriptive table will open and show the status of all aircraft in your area within the FS observable limits. Included win the status field will show the expected runway for take-off and departure including ai and your aircraft as they contact ground to taxi and approach for arrival. If you wish to can alt-tab in FS and Traffic look to switch views, or window both, you choice. Be sure FS is set to not pause on task switch.

 

FS defines parallel runways as runways that have a heading difference of 7.5 degrees or less. There is a technique called the crosswind runway technique to create pseudo short runways of 7.5 heading degrees difference filling in space between more separated runways so they can be simultaneously active. There is a tool in the freeware Airport Design Editor (ADE) to assist in this. That is available at:

 

http://www.scruffyduck.org/home/4584106797 and is good for FS9 and FSX.

 

An FAQ is here:

https://scruffyduck.screenstepslive.com/s/help_docs/m/20268

 

The link to the crosswind design tutorial is here:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/jzlq5wigk10k54f/Crosswind_Runway_Tutorial.zip

 

The link to the ADE manual is listed here:

 

http://www.scruffyduck.org/downloads/4584110854

 

The crosswind runway technique is also known as the STAR runway technique. The pseudo runways are short runways created in the "boony latitudes" so they will not show up visually nor on a map. Unfortunately, they will show up in your FS ATC runway list when choosing a runway.

 

Hope this helps.

KMSP - Minnesota: Land of 10,000 Puddles

Support Team

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  • 2 months later...
For real world observation look here at busy times:

 

http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KORD .

Click on the icon with the orange icon with the four crossed arrows for a full window. Your mouse wheel can scroll the zoom level and you can drag with the left arrow the view position. Note the mileage scale in black on the lower left of the map. If you zoom close enough you might tell what runway an aircraft is landing on. On the first page before going full screen if you scroll down on the right side you'll get to the current METAR. Aircraft in blue are arriving and green are departing. Each info box contains the flight identification, aircraft type, altitude (in 100's of feet), ground speed. Clicking on an aircraft will take you to a map of the filed plan and flight data for time, altitude requested, etc., scheduled and actual departure and arrival times, and a description of the aircraft. Pink aircraft are flying through that airspace without stopping there.

 

Clicking on an IFR tab can get you bundled and single .pdf charts of all procedures plus an airport diagram.

 

http://www.liveatc.net/feedindex.php?type=all and enter the ICAO code in the search box. You then get a list of the communications available including ATIS if present that you can select for monitoring.

 

Here's what I suggest for monitoring in FSX or FS9. Install the latest version of FSUIPC (3 for FS9, 4 for FSX and Steam FSX) from:

 

http://forum.simflight.com/topic/66139-updated-modules/

full and interim as needed. You will not need a paid user registration. The download is an .exe that will self install.

 

Now go here:

 

http://forum.simflight.com/topic/66136-useful-additional-programs/

 

and download the zip of Traffic Look. Extract that to any folder you wish. Traffic Look runs in its own window. Park an aircraft at you airport of interest at a busy time, then start Traffic Look. A descriptive table will open and show the status of all aircraft in your area within the FS observable limits. Included win the status field will show the expected runway for take-off and departure including ai and your aircraft as they contact ground to taxi and approach for arrival. If you wish to can alt-tab in FS and Traffic look to switch views, or window both, you choice. Be sure FS is set to not pause on task switch.

 

FS defines parallel runways as runways that have a heading difference of 7.5 degrees or less. There is a technique called the crosswind runway technique to create pseudo short runways of 7.5 heading degrees difference filling in space between more separated runways so they can be simultaneously active. There is a tool in the freeware Airport Design Editor (ADE) to assist in this. That is available at:

 

http://www.scruffyduck.org/home/4584106797 and is good for FS9 and FSX.

 

An FAQ is here:

https://scruffyduck.screenstepslive.com/s/help_docs/m/20268

 

The link to the crosswind design tutorial is here:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/jzlq5wigk10k54f/Crosswind_Runway_Tutorial.zip

 

The link to the ADE manual is listed here:

 

http://www.scruffyduck.org/downloads/4584110854

 

The crosswind runway technique is also known as the STAR runway technique. The pseudo runways are short runways created in the "boony latitudes" so they will not show up visually nor on a map. Unfortunately, they will show up in your FS ATC runway list when choosing a runway.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Hi again, it's been awhile since I've actually touched O'Hare until recently.

 

Although I did start working on stretching and adding runways, I eventually left the project untouched and later decided to simply use the cross-wind technique on O'Hare, enabling four runways for take-off and about three for landing (despite enabling runways at O'Hare for more usage).

 

The only problem I ran into is that now, regardless of the wind vector, the aircraft are always being sent West, even when a 16 knot headwind exists at 90.

 

I did make sure to have 9L and 9R be the primary runways (at the bottom of the runway list).

 

The runway list looks something like this:

 

4L/22R: 45.1 (or whatever heading the sim uses)

4R/22L: #

6: 52.8

....

1: 10.4

1: 2.6

16: 174.8

....

(some number): 151.4

14L/32R: 143.6

14R/32L: same

.....

10: 101.3

9L/22R: 93.5

9R/22L: 93.5

 

The crosswind numbers aren't quite the same since I found out runway 18 still exists in FS9 and I had to modify the list.

 

I don't think it's the crosswind technique that's off since all the Westward runways are aligned (that's 27L and R, 22L and R, and 32L and R). The problem is that the pattern is currently uni-directional regardless of wind.

Carlos Si
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I would just buy and install FSDreamteam's O'hare. It's well worth the money. I have Vegas right now and will add to the collection. Vegas also has that runway issue, but with FSDreamteam's airport they corrected that so I have traffic on all runways. I even have the Janet terminal for all my Janet's that fly to real-world destinations including my own built KXTA (Area-51)

OOM errors? Read this.

"The great thing about flight simulation is that in real life there are no do-overs." - Abraham Lincoln c. 1865

An awesome weather website with oodles of Info. and options.

Wile E. Coyote would be impressed.

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I recently purchased Blue Print Simulations KEWR. I am also having a problem with only 1 runway being used. In real life I know EWR uses both parallel runways. One for takeoffs and one for landings. For example I am cleared for departure on runway 22R. All aircraft departing and landing are cleared to 22R. 22L is never used. 22L should be used for landing. Same if cleared to runway 4L. All traffic is cleared for landing and takeoffs on 4L. 4R is not used. Is there a way to change this so both runways are used properly?
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I would just buy and install FSDreamteam's O'hare. It's well worth the money. I have Vegas right now and will add to the collection. Vegas also has that runway issue, but with FSDreamteam's airport they corrected that so I have traffic on all runways. I even have the Janet terminal for all my Janet's that fly to real-world destinations including my own built KXTA (Area-51)

 

That's definitely a consideration I have. However if I can get the runways to work right, if prefer that option. Regardless, I've looked into buying it.

 

I recently purchased Blue Print Simulations KEWR. I am also having a problem with only 1 runway being used. In real life I know EWR uses both parallel runways. One for takeoffs and one for landings. For example I am cleared for departure on runway 22R. All aircraft departing and landing are cleared to 22R. 22L is never used. 22L should be used for landing. Same if cleared to runway 4L. All traffic is cleared for landing and takeoffs on 4L. 4R is not used. Is there a way to change this so both runways are used properly?

 

Well we've got different problems actually; all my traffic is unidirectional on all the active runways regardless of wind. It /should/ be an easy fix though; do you have ADE?

Carlos Si
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I got to say. FSDreamTeam is well worth it. I really love KLAS as they have the Janet terminal added and since I have the Janet secret shuttles it works nice. I just had to rename the Janet parking spots to my Janet plane parking spot designators I have in the aircraft.cfg file.

 

I want to eventuality buy all the FSDreamteam airports. I really hope they make more. The more the better and just adds to the realism. Military airports would be an awesome addition! Like Edwards! Although, I do have a rather nice KEDW right now.

 

The golden egg would be KXTA. I have been in the process of making Area-51 myself, but it's not as good as a real designer could make it. The only thing that's cool about KXTA I have is the sat image scenery. I added a lot of the buildings, water tank and fuel tanks, etc with Abacus EZ Scenery Creator I think it's called. And I have military jets that once were there and still there fly in and out of there. I also test aircraft there myself trying to come up with V speeds for certain aircraft. LOL

OOM errors? Read this.

"The great thing about flight simulation is that in real life there are no do-overs." - Abraham Lincoln c. 1865

An awesome weather website with oodles of Info. and options.

Wile E. Coyote would be impressed.

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