ATC permission glitch

[gypsymoth]

ATC gives me permission to land on Rw 8. I'm 10 miles away.

It tells a Soar to hold there's a Dash 8 on the runway. I hear no more of this.

4.4 miles away my landing is confirmed.

I'm on final approach & see a Dash 8 taxiing onto the runway from the right & on the left one a 737 waits. I'm 1/2 mile from landing & am told Go Around. At no time did I hear ATC give the Dash permission to enter nor the 737 to hold. I thought aircraft on finals had priority ?

 

This is a newish problem. Is there a solution to my being told to land and other aircraft intruding ?

I will check other day times to see if this occurs then...........

I assume by the way that ATC in reality doesn't behave like this.....................!!

[ColR1948]

If you have TrafficToolBox installed, you can zap these offending aircraft out of the way, they are not gone for good only that scenario.

Sometimes you get permission to land and another aircraft overtakes you and lands before you then you have to go around, well if that ever happens zap it gone then you can land.

Also you may find yourself in a long queue to take off, again zap the ones in front out of the way then you are next to go.

 

Col.

[hjwalter]

A small addon program like AI Smooth will solve most of your problems by keeping AI aircraft out of your way, at least the ones flying near you and when approaching your destination airport. However, even then the default FS9 ATC will never be perfect.

I've been using this program for years and I love it.

 

Hans

[gypsymoth]

I'll give it a whirl but I think it would have been better had I asked if FS9's ATC mirrored real world behavior.......I am rapidly learning the answer is NO & I wonder why not.

 

I could always deselect the traffic bgl !!

 

Cheers.

Terry.

[gypsymoth]

I've looked for AI Smooth but don't get any links to it...................

[ColR1948]

There is another similar program called AI seperation if you want to try it:

https://flyawaysimulation.com/downloads/files/2741/fs2004-flight-simulator-ai-traffic-separation/

 

AI smooth try here:

http://www.avsimrus.com/f/fs2004-uti...ction=download

[gypsymoth]

Thanks but the avsim link is dead.........I went avsimru & have managed to get Firefox to get an English translation & found 2231-aismooth-v120.zip.

I'll get back to when I have it working.....thanks.

Edited December 16, 2019 by gypsymoth

[gypsymoth]

Thanks for the tip. I got AISmooth from AvsimRU btw..................

[johnhinson]

ATC gives me permission to land on Rw 8. I'm 10 miles away.

It tells a Soar to hold there's a Dash 8 on the runway. I hear no more of this.

4.4 miles away my landing is confirmed.

I'm on final approach & see a Dash 8 taxiing onto the runway from the right & on the left one a 737 waits. I'm 1/2 mile from landing & am told Go Around. At no time did I hear ATC give the Dash permission to enter nor the 737 to hold. I thought aircraft on finals had priority ?

 

This is a newish problem. Is there a solution to my being told to land and other aircraft intruding ?

I will check other day times to see if this occurs then...........

I assume by the way that ATC in reality doesn't behave like this.....................!!

It is not a newish problem. Nothing has changed. A decision whether to clear aircraft to land or clear aircraft to take off is based on the distance the landing aircraft is from the runway - it is a fixed figure. If the landing aircraft hasn't reached that point, then aircraft will continue to take off - but normally they will be clear before the landing aircraft reaches the runway. This is how it is programmed and in most circumstances it works well. The one situation where it doesn't work perfectly is where taxiways do not take aircraft to the end of the runway and they have to taxi out along the runway and turn. This consumes valuable time against a simple take-off.

 

There are a lot of reasons you could say "I assume by the way that ATC in reality doesn't behave like this" but the truth is that it is an extremely clever system. Every AI aircraft responds to orders just like the player aircraft, ATC doesn't fly them. So you are getting no more or less priority than the other aircraft around you, and maybe you might have been miffed to be on the other side and were held for ages awaiting take-off!

 

It isn't perfect, and there are a variety of alternative add-ons available to replace it. None of them interact with other aircraft, FS's own ATC continues to do that with the sound off in the background. Instead the add-ons try to play catch-up by watching what is going on and then playing appropriate calls, generally after the event.

 

John

[gypsymoth]

Well, interesting info you give me but it's new to my experience at EGHH & I've had FS9 for 11+yrs or so.

 

I have the latest FSUIPC & with AISmooth running & 1/2 mile to touchdown I get go around, having been given OK to land at 4 miles or so. There is one AI waiting & no atc chatter except my go around. I've been held in line of 15 waiting for TO at HHR when I had a lot of AI added aome years & the same waiting to land with lots being to to go around.

 

I don't know that being miffed accounts for my attitude but with no flying traffic & 1 waiting, getting a GA doesn't seem reasonable.

 

You're right, it's imperfect. Being a 'game' I've tailored it & disabled the traffic bgl :-)

 

TW.

[johnhinson]

I have just looked at the layout of EGHH and Runway 8 is indeed a runway where aircraft have to taxi out along the runway and turn. That is undoubtedly the reason you were stymied. As you say, not realistic but at least you now understand why it happened.

 

I suspect in real life smaller aircraft like the Dash 8 don't need to do so, and take off directly from the taxiway intersection point but FS's ATC doesn't have a means to establish which aircraft can and can't do that.

 

John

[ColR1948]

I hate back-track runways, what I do if I want to use that airfield a lot is change the layout with AFCAD.

A add a taxiway that joins the runway at the start rather than part way, it does help a bit, I don't care if it's fictional or not.

 

Col.

[gypsymoth]

I'm using UK2000 addon scenery & EGHH replicates the airfield of 1970-80 before upgrading = grab 018. The waiting AI was at the red X'

 

I made HURN 1943 with a series of other south coast airfields for my Golden Wing 3.