I'm done with FS2020

Mark, if FS9 is so good & FS2020 is so bad... then why keep visiting the FS2020 forum? Maybe secretly, you like FS2020 :)

(Don’t think I’ve been to the FS9 forum for about 15 years)

 

 

Regards

Steve

 

I look at all the forums including FS2002. This one is sometimes worth posting in but that doesn't mean I have an interest in the game. I may have an interest in the discussion so I post. Not a hope I will buy it and it doesn't state anywhere ownership is required to create a post.

I don't know what it is, but I love msfs2020. It works great. Every once in a while it freezes up but all in all it works great. All my equipment works, GPs works , even little nav works great. Here is my set up

 

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

 

 

That's one hell of a set up but my setup beats yours hands down..... One computer two screens one flight yoke with pedals and VR! and that's the crowning moment, the icing on the cake VR....

How many complex airliners you flown this week?

I know you don't fly them but I think you get the point. :pilot:

 

Well, I've flown the A320-NX this week. One of my favorite planes in MSFS2020. And your point is?

I think if we had taken MS highest speck for FS2020 as the lowest speck we would all be running FS2020 without any problems by now ha

I believe that the problem stems from Milton Friedman's analysis of American business. Friedman stated that business's are under no obligation to anyone other than their stockholders; Bill Gates along with his coneys took that message to heart.

 

Microsoft's sole interest in MSFS2020 is to extract as much money out of the project as possible, while spending the least amount of money in the process.

 

My guess is that Asobo receives about enough money from Microsoft for program maintenance and upgrades to support about two junior programmers with occasional tech support and guidance from one of the senior guys. They may also have a few minimum wage artistic types doing graphics stuff, aka eye candy. We can see from eight months of history that they move at a two steps forward, one step behind pace. I doubt that it will ever be more than that unless Google or Facebook or someone like that launches a Flight Simulator competitor.

 

IMO, you'd better like what you have because anything better will be a long time coming.

 

I have an engineer brother who worked for ten years at a major gaming design company (EA). I actually got to visit their headquarters in Vancouver a bunch of times. What you describe does not sound remotely realistic at all. This business operation for producing these games is far more sophisticated than I think you perceive it to be. And the designers and engineers doing this work are, frankly, working way harder than they should be. Millions of dollars are at stake. Long hours, into the night, a lot of weekends, etc. Burnout is common. I don't know how my brother did it for so long but when you're in your 20s and 30s it's easy to say, "This is just the way it's supposed to be."

 

As for a Miltonian philosophical approach to why some people hate MSFS and swear off of it, I don't think it's that abstract or complicated at all. Here's the simple truth: the vast majority of us love the game and don't have problems with it. Simple.

Well, I've flown the A320-NX this week. One of my favorite planes in MSFS2020. And your point is?

 

My point is you and every other MSFS user have flown the same plane as your selection isn't exactly great and the A320 is not exactly all that complex. You can trash FS9 but it's far more a flight simulator than MSFS.

 

I struggle to even see PMDG releasing for MSFS PC. I've said in the past, the only place you may see a PMDG aircraft will be on the Xbox version of MSFS.

My point is you and every other MSFS user have flown the same plane as your selection isn't exactly great and the A320 is not exactly all that complex. You can trash FS9 but it's far more a flight simulator than MSFS.

 

I struggle to even see PMDG releasing for MSFS PC. I've said in the past, the only place you may see a PMDG aircraft will be on the Xbox version of MSFS.

 

Interesting that you know what planes I and "every other MSFS user" are flying. What nonsense. By all means, if you like FS9 use it, but as other have asked, in that case why hang around MSFS forums? Just to bug people? This appears to be your main purpose, but I for one find it tiresome hearing the same juvenile prattle over and over, and will not be responding further. Flying in MSFS is much more interesting.

and will not be responding further.

Well that'll be a novelty. I'm only here half the time replying to your posts.

 

Interesting that you know what planes I and "every other MSFS user" are flying.

You can't be flying that much as there are still hardly any jets and we are months in.

 

I'm heading back to my iFly 737 in my ancient FS9. Say hi to the wife and kids for me! :pilot:

Guys, every sim as it's problems limitations, every simmer expects and wants more than the software developers can deliver...... that's about sums it all up....... have a happy weekend.....

Yes the realsim gear still works. I was flying last night (4/17/21) and everything is still running great. I don't know why so many people are having trouble. It could be there computers they are using or there internet connection.

 

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

 

Thanks for the update. I'll try mine again. I miss it already.

I have an engineer brother who worked for ten years at (EA) ........

EA designs and sells their product; however, the arrangement that Asobo has re: MSFS is completely different. Asobo is merely a contractor, they were hired by Microsoft to write the code (create the "game"), Microsoft defined the product and even supplied the background landscape. Microsoft markets the "game" and Microsoft receives 100% of the money users pay for the product.

 

Asobo is a gaming software company that produces its own products, for them MSFS is something out of left field, and from what I've read they don't attach much importance to it. Asobo no doubt has a similar relationship with its own products as you saw at UA, but for the sim, all work on the product has to be billable to Microsoft or else they're providing charity work for one of the largest companies on the planet. Nothing is done unless Microsoft agrees to pay for it.

 

Apples and Oranges.

As for a Miltonian philosophical approach to why some people hate MSFS and swear off of it, I don't think it's that abstract or complicated at all. Here's the simple truth: the vast majority of us love the game and don't have problems with it. Simple.

 

Well said. Thanks!

Well said. Thanks!

I love the game and use it myself but that doesn't mean that it doesn't have problems; MSFS does have some very frustrating problems and has had problems from its first release. MSFS is exceptional for the number of problems it has, and the slow response to provide remedies; for example: ability to use multiple screens isn't scheduled to become available until next year, the number of people who have been forced to re-download 125GB of data (in some cases repeatedly) is unconscionable, and on and on; we have come to just accept that updates will have bugs.

 

Bugs and problems are the underlying subject for this whole thread.

 

It's a great game, but let's not pretend it is something it isn't.

 

I will add that I don't think it is logical or helpful for us users to help Microsoft cover up for the product's deficiencies.

Edited April 17, 2021 by sfojimbo

I fully agree. I think we are all well aware of problems with MSFS, but haven't seen anybody trying to cover them up (there may be such folks, but I haven't encountered them). Personally, I have both encountered problems and sought help in the forums, and also have tried to help others when I think I can. It's all about being constructive and positive, rather than destructive and negative (as some unfortunately are, but that's life).

I look at all the forums including FS2002. This one is sometimes worth posting in but that doesn't mean I have an interest in the game. I may have an interest in the discussion so I post. Not a hope I will buy it and it doesn't state anywhere ownership is required to create a post.

 

Do you own the product?

EA designs and sells their product; however, the arrangement that Asobo has re: MSFS is completely different. Asobo is merely a contractor, they were hired by Microsoft to write the code (create the "game"), Microsoft defined the product and even supplied the background landscape. Microsoft markets the "game" and Microsoft receives 100% of the money users pay for the product.

 

Asobo is a gaming software company that produces its own products, for them MSFS is something out of left field, and from what I've read they don't attach much importance to it. Asobo no doubt has a similar relationship with its own products as you saw at UA, but for the sim, all work on the product has to be billable to Microsoft or else they're providing charity work for one of the largest companies on the planet. Nothing is done unless Microsoft agrees to pay for it.

 

Apples and Oranges.

 

Huh? EA contracts out all the time, and actually suffered through tremendous financial problems some years ago. Microsoft is far more profitable and massive than EA. I’ve listened to interviews of the actual engineers who work at Asobo and they sound like typical employees of a multimillion dollar gaming venture.

I love the game and use it myself but that doesn't mean that it doesn't have problems; MSFS does have some very frustrating problems and has had problems from its first release. MSFS is exceptional for the number of problems it has...[/i]

 

It’s also exceptional for offering players a simulation of the entire planet Earth.

 

I’ve been flying a lot in India lately, which is not even a popular destination for sim users. Asia has not gotten any world updates yet except for Japan. Yet the accuracy of visual landscapes in obscure locations like the Thar Desert in Rajasthan continue to blow my mind. And I swear it feels like it’s getting visually better and better over time. (This is consistent with MS and Asobo reporting that their Bing imagery is not set in stone but a constantly improving project).

 

Yet right here at home where I grew up in Arizona, I’m able to fly over the actual baseball fields in small rural towns where I played high school ball.

 

Pretty amazing game. “Exceptional” is pretty fair.

Do you own the product?

No. Hope you aren't going to tell me I can't comment without owning it.

 

It's very clear to me MSFS is a total mess and also why.

You can go back to pre announcement of MSFS and search what I said.

You can go back to post announcement and pre release and search what I said.

You can go to release and search what I said.

There will be no one who has nailed every prediction as I have.

 

To do a mass summary of ALL the points I ever made above, a flight sim of FS9/FSX complexity is just no longer possible in modern times.

You are witnessing what happens when someone tries to create one with MSFS.

Actually, you are consistently wrong! I have had just two issues with the program since i bought it in August last year. One week after my purchase, they said my subscription expired. A phone call got that quickly resolved. I did have a CTD once or twice when using the map, but that got fixed. Yes there are some very occasional elevation errors (I have found a few of those in FSX as well) and a few missing airports (KPHG in particular is one I miss a lot!!), but those are just annoyances. The program works fine for me. I don't have a really exotic setup or machine, I don't have any addons but i did get the Premium Deluxe version. The last update went smoothly, not a hitch, and as I said, it worked fine afterward. NOTHING comes close to the emersion experience in fitting into your environment. I don't want working air conditioner switches, I want the world to look like the real thing. Other products have their place, but nothing comes close to the experience of seeing the world in MSFS. I certainly can't see this as a mess, it works fine. Almost every problem gets back to some user created device or addon or hardware mismatch. That isn't the product's fault. If I put a supercharger on my Hudson Hornet, and it breaks, that isn't Hudson's fault.

Almost every problem gets back to some user created device or addon or hardware mismatch. That isn't the product's fault. If I put a supercharger on my Hudson Hornet, and it breaks, that isn't Hudson's fault.

 

I'm not going to go looking again for the 100 million things wrong with this sim and I haven't memorized them all ready to place in a reply like this.

First things that come to mind, how accurately does your real world weather work?

How well does your AI traffic work?

Do you have lots of AI in your skies?

When you do, how is your performance?

How is your ATC?

 

I could literally go on forever. If you have not had CTD's or not had to do a million re-installs, it doesn't mean the sim works or that other users don't know what they are doing or other users have poor PC's or internet.

It's broken for you like it is for everyone else. The only difference is you haven't had anything that's stopped you enjoying the sim....YET!

Oh, MSFS2020 is plenty complex:

 

Maybe too complex and for many wrong reasons; and maybe too complex to fix all the recurring problems. (My main peeve is the really crazy and overly-complicated camera system). Perhaps the obvious answer is a modest proposal: Go back and virtually start all over - create a MSFS2020, Version II over time. After all, there were about 12 previous MS versions. But keep the amazing scenery.

 

So Asobo - Maybe next time, as they say, just "Keep it Simple, stupid!"

Oh, MSFS2020 is plenty complex:

 

Maybe too complex and for many wrong reasons; and maybe too complex to fix all the recurring problems. (My main peeve is the really crazy and overly-complicated camera system). Perhaps the obvious answer is a modest proposal: Go back and virtually start all over - create a MSFS2020, Version II over time. After all, there were about 12 previous MS versions. But keep the amazing scenery.

 

So Asobo - Maybe next time, as they say, just "Keep it Simple, stupid!"

 

I kinda agree with this. The camera system is ok once you played around with it and you can get something that kinda works. But it is not the simple, smooth and effective camera system of other sims, especially FSX/P3D/DCS World and it removed a lot of my initial enthusiasm for the product. I desperately miss the fly-by view which every other sim has. So, I'm finding that I spend less and less time in the new MSFS and returning to the older FSX and P3D. Fortunately I'm using MSFS on my gamepass account and haven't spent the big bucks on it yet. Will be while until I do so, and definitely not before they add a flyby view.

Actually, you are consistently wrong!

 

Of course, you have an unfair advantage in this argument: you actually own and use the sim!

No. Hope you aren't going to tell me I can't comment without owning it.

 

It's very clear to me MSFS is a total mess and also why.

You can go back to pre announcement of MSFS and search what I said.

You can go back to post announcement and pre release and search what I said.

You can go to release and search what I said.

There will be no one who has nailed every prediction as I have.

 

To do a mass summary of ALL the points I ever made above, a flight sim of FS9/FSX complexity is just no longer possible in modern times.

You are witnessing what happens when someone tries to create one with MSFS.

 

Ok, that's fair you don't own the product. Don't have to to use (Gamepass). 2nd question: how long have you used this product? Weeks? Months? Just what exactly is your personal user experience with this sim?

and will not be responding further.

 

It's all about being constructive and positive, rather than destructive and negative (as some unfortunately are, but that's life).

 

Of course, you have an unfair advantage in this argument: you actually own and use the sim!

 

You are addicted to referencing me every post. lol

 

Ok, that's fair you don't own the product. Don't have to to use (Gamepass). 2nd question: how long have you used this product? Weeks? Months? Just what exactly is your personal user experience with this sim?

 

Please post a screenshot of your busy international airport and enlighten me.