Cessna 152 max weight = 100% fuel + pilot and co-pilot (170 lbs each) only??

Let me get this straight. With a co-pilot and full fuel tanks, the C152 can't bring any cargo??

Let me get this straight. With a co-pilot and full fuel tanks, the C152 can't bring any cargo??

 

Sounds about right. When I learned we even had to weigh each pilot, to be sure.

I know it can't fill tanks and pax seat, even a heavy pilot needed to be careful.

It certainly looks like it, it also depends on the weight of the crew not being over 170lbs each on whether full fuel can be carried.

Where in a 152 can you store any cargo? Your wife/girl friend might find room for her purse? LOL!!

 

Rick :cool::cool:

Let me get this straight. With a co-pilot and full fuel tanks, the C152 can't bring any cargo??

 

Where in a 152 can you store any cargo? Your wife/girl friend might find room for her purse? LOL!!

 

Rick :cool::cool:

 

Actually, there is room behind the seats for a small amount of baggage (couple of suitcases, etc.) but, as mentioned above, not much weight allowance with full fuel. Of course it was intended as an inexpensive trainer, not a travel machine, so that's not much of a problem.

 

The bigger problem was when you had a 200+ lb instructor and an equally large student -- then you had to leave off fuel, and to be careful how much you topped it off.

 

In point of fact, few light singles can fill the seats, add a bit of baggage AND carry full fuel. There are usually tradeoffs. Even with many light twins you have to watch your load (that should be calculated as a matter of course, anyway).

Edited November 8, 2021 by lnuss

Actually, there is room behind the seats for a small amount of baggage (couple of suitcases, etc.) but, as mentioned above, not much weight allowance with full fuel. Of course it was intended as an inexpensive trainer, not a travel machine, so that's not much of a problem.

 

The bigger problem was when you had a 200+ lb instructor and an equally large student -- then you had to leave off fuel, and to be careful how much you topped it off.

 

In point of fact, few light singles can fill the seats, add a bit of baggage AND carry full fuel. There are usually tradeoffs. Even with many light twins you have to watch your load (that should be calculated as a matter of course, anyway).

 

Well said Larry! And looking at accident reports including one here in Ky., weight and balance certainly should be stressed more than they are in training.

 

A new pilot was so proud of his license he took three (3) of his buds up for a flight in a 152. He barely cleared some trees about a mile from the airport on takeoff.

 

Then stalled on final when he dropped his flaps as he would have when flying with his instructor. The flight resulted in one dead and three injured. And considering he was over a flat and treeless golf course at the time, it could easily have been four dead on many airport final approaches. Approaching SDF he'd might have crashed onto a heavily traveled Interstate Highway! :eek::eek:

That wasn't just weight and balance -- it was stupidity, and I don't think you can blame that on lack of training. Some people think they live a charmed life ("It can't happen to me"). They were fortunate that only one died.

That wasn't just weight and balance -- it was stupidity, and I don't think you can blame that on lack of training. Some people think they live a charmed life ("It can't happen to me"). They were fortunate that only one died.

 

I agree with the comment that stupidity was involved. And I truly agree it could have been much worse!!

Let me get this straight. With a co-pilot and full fuel tanks, the C152 can't bring any cargo??

 

hahahahahahaha welcome to the C152. that 1600lb gross weight sneaks up on ya pretty quickly :D I got my Private in a 150 (152 with 10 less hp) and with one of the CFI's I flew with I could only take 13 gallons of fuel. about an hrs worth plus reserves. got checked out in the 172 shortly after with a MTOW of 2400lbs and now fly the 172S with G1000 which have the 180hp lycoming and a MTOW of 2550lbs. goes a bit further but is still a "3 person plus bags" airplane if you want to travel anywhere.

So how does one look for a top wing, that has a range of 500+ miles, has 400 lbs weight for pilot and co-pilot, full fuel, and 200 lbs of cargo?

So how does one look for a top wing, that has a range of 500+ miles, has 400 lbs weight for pilot and co-pilot, full fuel, and 200 lbs of cargo?

 

I see 2 options for you:

 

1. Choose the Cessna Caravan. (The easy choice).

 

2. Since it’s only a sim, you can lie about how much you and your passenger weigh. :) This would allow you to choose the 172. The problem with this choice is that the manual I have for the 172 says it’s only got 40 gallons of usable gas. I’d only try this if you’re heading eastbound with a nice tailwind. I’d hate to see you have a simulated crash a little short of your 500 mile destination. :D

A Cessna 182 would be able to do what you want.

Welcome to the real world of light airplanes! The limitations you have tapped into are both real and frustrating. Many, if not most, GA pilots fly overweight at one time or another, the result of a combination of lack of knowledge of regulations and/or the POH limitations, and the automobile-induced line of thinking that posits that if a vehicle has so many seats and a fuel tank and a cargo area it must be OK to fill them all at the same time. By Gosh I paid for all of that so I should be able to use it!

 

Actually, many autos are occasionally driven overweight too, but how many of us actually know the max weight for our car?

 

As for your question about an airplane with the specs above, the answer is look for one that can handle roughly 1.5 times any of those limits and then go light! Example: the Cessna 182 can handle the range with its' reduced fuel load of 64 gallons (87 gallons is max in that airplane), and it can also handle the crew weight. It can also handle 200 lb of cargo, although some of that may have to go into the back seats instead of the cargo area due to weight and balance and/or structural limits. In any event, I just ran the numbers on a 182T with the G-1000 and with 400 lb in the front seats, 200 in the cargo area, and 72 gallons of fuel you are just within limits - 3093 weight and cg of 44.5 which, although somewhat aft loaded, is within the cg limits. With this setup you could go about 5 hours with an extra hour of fuel for reserve, and given a TAS of around 130 kts you would cover 650 miles no wind.

Avallillo chirped it -- "Welcome to the real world of light airplanes!" His explanations about limitations are excellent.

 

The Cessna 182 is an extremely versatile light aircraft which, with a bit more expense, solves a lot of the limitations of the less expensive birds. The Cherokee 235 (Dakota in later years) is the similar Piper offering, though the C-182 has the edge in real life versatility, by a little bit, and is decidedly better for bush pilots, partly because of the high wing (better ground clearance) and partly because of certain low speed handling benefits.

...In any event, I just ran the numbers ....

 

Excellent reply. Thank you. How did you 'ran the numbers'. Are there sources of infomration or websites I can use to run the numbers myself?

 

Also, do you know if there is a Cessna 182 or equivalent available in MSFS?

 

In other sims, this is available:

https://www.carenado.com/sitecarenado/product/ct210m-centurion-ii-hd-series-fsx-p3d/

 

Btw, this is for a sight seeing trip around the world (ATW) in MSFS.

Edited November 9, 2021 by oneleg

FYI, an option for the C150 (don't know if the '152 had this) was a child's seat in the baggage area. I rode with a friend and his father in one. My buddy and I were only twelve or so so I THINK we MAY have been under max gross weight. However, that was one crowded little Cessna!

How did you 'ran the numbers'.

 

You get the pilot's operating handbook or flight manual for the aircraft, go to the section on weight and balance, and follow the instructions. A "sample" of how this works is:

 

http://trumpetb.net/alph/wb182R.html

 

Here's an online version of a POH for the Cessna 182P:

 

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1156093/Cessna-Skylane-182p.html#manual

https://www.carenado.com/sitecarenado/product/ct182t-skylane-msfs2020/

It is not a default aircraft.

That child's seat was, indeed, for a child (and cramped). The entire baggage area is limited to 120 lbs, including the seat (if installed). The very early C-150s were roomier and (IMO) more fun to fly, certainly more comfortable, than those after 1960 or so (not sure of the exact year of change). In 1964 they added "Omni-Vision" (a rear window and a change in the shape of the aft part of the cockpit).

 

Online POH: https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1300564/Cessna-150.html?page=28#manual

Edited November 9, 2021 by lnuss

Thank you.

Well said Larry! And looking at accident reports including one here in Ky., weight and balance certainly should be stressed more than they are in training.

 

A new pilot was so proud of his license he took three (3) of his buds up for a flight in a 152. He barely cleared some trees about a mile from the airport on takeoff.

 

Then stalled on final when he dropped his flaps as he would have when flying with his instructor. The flight resulted in one dead and three injured. And considering he was over a flat and treeless golf course at the time, it could easily have been four dead on many airport final approaches. Approaching SDF he'd might have crashed onto a heavily traveled Interstate Highway! :eek::eek:

 

This must have a been a 172, since the 152 is only a 2 place airplane...unless he made 3 flights and crashed on each one!

This must have a been a 172, since the 152 is only a 2 place airplane...unless he made 3 flights and crashed on each one!

 

It's possible to place two people (not too big though) in the baggage area, though quite cramped. There ARE people stupid enough to do this (thankfully few). So assuming Rupert was correct about it being a C-152 (that's what made it noteworthy), it was the extreme overload that caused the new pilot to stall.

As to how I "ran the numbers", I fly them for CAP in the real world, and I used my Garmin Pilot EFB program on my iPad, which has complete weight and balance calculators for all of the Cessnas I fly.

 

As for a good 182 in MSFS - I have the Carenado Skylane in my FS2020 and it seems to be very good in terms of operation, and great on looks as well!