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Thread: Default 737 . Attaining glideslope problem. Oversteering?

  1. #1

    Default Default 737 . Attaining glideslope problem. Oversteering?

    Hello
    Flying ILS landings, I find that when pressing the App button to turn on to the glideslope, the plane turns on to the Slope and then goes past quite a way, then doesn't return to the runway heading fast enough and when it does it goes past it again.....
    End result - I get on to the runway heading almost never in time .

    No other plane that I fly has this problem. The Maltby jets are great, so are Jen Kristensons Douglas propliners, so is the 747, Bombardiers - all ok.
    Just this 737 gives me the problem.

    Any ideas? I shall check the fuel status. Could too much fuel be the cause?

    Cheers

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    San Francisco, California
    Posts
    18,365

    Default

    Fuel load, incorrect altitude while flying the localizer and being above the Glideslope when trying to engage, and not having proper flaps can all cause the problem you are having.
    Mr Zippy Sent from my keyboard using "Whackamole", NudgeAKey + 2 Fingers

    No flight Sim installed until I get a new computer.

  3. #3

    Default

    Noted. Will check fuel. I had wondered on previous occasions whether too much flap too early, or too low a speed might cause it.
    So this time I was doing 226 knots when hit the App. I was at the right( instructed) height.
    I will check the speeds again😀

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Westminster, CO
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    7,488

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    Some FSX aircraft are extremely sloppy in their response to the autopilot. I know this can be changed in the .air file, but it would take a lot of experimentation to find the necessary changes.

    So you might consider getting the heading within 15º-20º of the final course and slowing to final approach airspeed (and maybe aircraft configuration too) while still several miles before reaching the FAF, and only then hit APP.

    Larry N.

    As Skylab would say:
    Remember: Aviation is NOT an exact Science!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    San Francisco, California
    Posts
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    I normally use ATC and fly IFR flights. I am within 30 degrees of the runway heading just before picking up the localizer at about 16 miles out. In the 737, I would be at 180knots, and 15 degrees flaps and probably no more than 2000 feet. I then engage the APP/APR button. At about 9-10 miles out you should engage the Glideslope and begin reducing speed to approx 138 knots and at least 20 degrees flaps.

    I drop gear at 12 miles out and set flaps for landing (depending on runway length, I rarely use full flaps).
    Mr Zippy Sent from my keyboard using "Whackamole", NudgeAKey + 2 Fingers

    No flight Sim installed until I get a new computer.

  6. #6

    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by lnuss View Post
    Some FSX aircraft are extremely sloppy in their response to the autopilot. I know this can be changed in the .air file, but it would take a lot of experimentation to find the necessary changes.

    So you might consider getting the heading within 15º-20º of the final course and slowing to final approach airspeed (and maybe aircraft configuration too) while still several miles before reaching the FAF, and only then hit APP.
    I did not approach the LOCalizer with greater than 30º offset -Try flying a `cleaner` approach and avoid those last-minute shenanigans!

    I always flew to a point about 15-20 miles away from the glideslope and made the turns to close-to-final about there. The 737 is NOT a maneouvrable fighter, no matter the fuel load!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    South Florida
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    Cas141 - Do yourself a favor and go on to YouTube and view some of the videos they offer on ILS landings! If you are having trouble with the default Boeing 737, you are obviously doing something wrong, as this aircraft is one of the most docile jetliners you could use in learning ILS approach and landings! Sometimes we jump right into something that is unfamiliar to us, hoping we can learn as we go, and you might be able to do that with some things, but ILS approach to landings, better familiarize yourself thoroughly to avoid any unwanted frustrations! Once you acquire the skills, you will wonder why they were so difficult, especially, when singling out one particular aircraft as a problem child!

    JMHO and good luck with the ILS!

    Rick

  8. #8

    Default

    Thanks for the advice(s). I will try some if the suggestions, but I get the impression many of you fly without using( or ignoring😀) the default ATC.?
    I follow their instructions, and if I don't, I get repeatedly given that same instruction.
    On every other plane, this works, and the ILS landing goes smoothly. I have done dozens on Maltbys Comets and Tridents, default 747s, Beechcraft, Bombardiers, Dc4s.
    If I depart from the instructions, and approach as is suggested here, I'll see what happens.
    But first I will try the fuel load adjustment.
    I am not new to this. I use FSX in windows XP ! That's how long I've been at it, but it is just lately that this 737 has started.

    It will be interesting to see what happens when In"disobey" the ATC😁

    Thanks again

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
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    South Florida
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    3,783

    Default

    One thing you might check, the Autopilot section of the aircraft.cfg to make sure your B737 has been set up properly. I print the below and keep a "cheat sheet" in my desk drawer to check all aircraft I
    might download. These settings are appropriate for almost any aircraft you may be using. It won't hurt to take a look at your settings for the B737!

    I wish you well. I mainly land "localizer only" which is basically an ILS approach to landing WITHOUT
    ATC direction. Something to think about while getting your aircraft in order. All aircraft should behave close to one another, without having one "bad apple" in the group.

    You and others say check the fuel, yes, might contribute to your aircraft's problem, but it's not the only thing that's interfering with not having a successful ILS landing. I can takeoff with fuel tanks, fly one pattern and setup for a localizer only landing, and be able to land a B737, Airbus or any other jetliner without issue!

    Good luck and keep at it! You and the B737 will become best of friends and the others might get better also!

    Rick


    [autopilot]
    autopilot_available=1
    flight_director_available=1
    default_vertical_speed=800
    autothrottle_available=1
    autothrottle_arming_required=1
    autothrottle_max_rpm = 90
    autothrottle_takeoff_ga=1
    pitch_takeoff_ga = 8;
    max_pitch=10.0
    max_pitch_acceleration=1.0
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt=2.0
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt=1.5
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint=20000.0
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint=28000.0
    max_bank=25
    max_bank_acceleration=1.8
    max_bank_velocity=3.00
    max_throttle_rate=0.10
    nav_proportional_control=9.00
    nav_integrator_control=0.25
    nav_derivative_control=0.00
    nav_integrator_boundary=2.50
    nav_derivative_boundary=0.00
    gs_proportional_control=9.52
    gs_integrator_control=0.26
    gs_derivative_control=0.00
    gs_integrator_boundary=0.70
    gs_derivative_boundary=0.00
    yaw_damper_gain = 1.0

  10. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Downwind66 View Post
    One thing you might check, the Autopilot section of the aircraft.cfg to make sure your B737 has been set up properly. I print the below and keep a "cheat sheet" in my desk drawer to check all aircraft I
    might download. These settings are appropriate for almost any aircraft you may be using. It won't hurt to take a look at your settings for the B737!

    I wish you well. I mainly land "localizer only" which is basically an ILS approach to landing WITHOUT
    ATC direction. Something to think about while getting your aircraft in order. All aircraft should behave close to one another, without having one "bad apple" in the group.

    You and others say check the fuel, yes, might contribute to your aircraft's problem, but it's not the only thing that's interfering with not having a successful ILS landing. I can takeoff with fuel tanks, fly one pattern and setup for a localizer only landing, and be able to land a B737, Airbus or any other jetliner without issue!

    Good luck and keep at it! You and the B737 will become best of friends and the others might get better also!

    Rick


    [autopilot]
    autopilot_available=1
    flight_director_available=1
    default_vertical_speed=800
    autothrottle_available=1
    autothrottle_arming_required=1
    autothrottle_max_rpm = 90
    autothrottle_takeoff_ga=1
    pitch_takeoff_ga = 8;
    max_pitch=10.0
    max_pitch_acceleration=1.0
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt=2.0
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt=1.5
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint=20000.0
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint=28000.0
    max_bank=25
    max_bank_acceleration=1.8
    max_bank_velocity=3.00
    max_throttle_rate=0.10
    nav_proportional_control=9.00
    nav_integrator_control=0.25
    nav_derivative_control=0.00
    nav_integrator_boundary=2.50
    nav_derivative_boundary=0.00
    gs_proportional_control=9.52
    gs_integrator_control=0.26
    gs_derivative_control=0.00
    gs_integrator_boundary=0.70
    gs_derivative_boundary=0.00
    yaw_damper_gain = 1.0

    Thank you very much. Will check.

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