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what vintage/classic aircraft are planned for FS2020 ?


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I don't mind the new stuff, some is quite nice... but for me, there was flight before glass cockpits. There were piston powered airliners by Lockheed Constellations and Boeing B-337 and others. There was the oceangoing flying boats, there was the amazing B-707, and Douglas C-124.

 

But so far, the only large vintage aircraft I've heard being in development is the DC-3. And that's a great choice. But... is that all? Is anyone intending to make any others????

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Ok so I have since discovered a few:

 

in vintage warbirds, the Spitfire and P51 Mustang are in development.

 

For very old airliners, there is the legendary Douglas DC-3, and also the Boeing 247D, which is sort of like a smaller DC-3. These two are also in development, no idea of release date.

 

Also, there is a Grumman Goose, an amphibious seaplane. It's available to download and fly already, and free. There doesn't seem to be any showstopping problems with it, but it's still being developed, I think they want to include features not yet in it (the radios weren't functional in the first release AFAIK). But it's free and it looks good:

 

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/initial-release-grumman-goose-g21a-redux-ii/338063

 

https://www.msfsaddon.com/2020/12/msfs2020-grumman-goose-g21a-redux-ii.html

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This is a very rudimentary attempt at the Spirit of St. Louis, but I gave it a shot for kicks and it was fun/interesting. For this the VR headset is a huge advantage, because the line of vision from the pilot's seat is so bizarre.

 

I don't know how accurate the model is, and nor did I figure out whether the fuel capacity and fuel efficiency are correct (for purposes of an Atlantic crossing).

 

http://www.allflightmods.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/msfs2020-aircraft/spirit-of-st-louis-aircraft/

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  • 1 month later...

Aerosoft is aiming to release a deHavilland DHC-6 Twin Otter in the Summer of 2021, and it looks great!

 

 

Aerosoft has stated publicly that they have put the DHC-2 Beaver on the production list, but it's too early to know when it'll be started or finished. After stating that they got a lot of people posting that they look forward to the Beaver!

 

Someone asked if Aerosoft would be making or porting a Consolidated PBY Catalina, and the company rep in the forums said it's not planned, but he hopes to, but didn't know if they would, or when that might happen. But it sounds like it's a possibility. This makes me happy, as I found myself very surprised at how much I enjoyed Mike Stone's PBY Catalina in FS2004: something about how it's anphibious makes it a challenge to land on runways, and a challenge on smaller lakes, coupled with the fact there was no flaps, making energy management and angle of attack very important to do a successful approach and landing!! I never thought I'd enjoy such a sedate and slow airplane on a computer, but I ended up loving it!

 

 

I look forward to all three, and other vintage aircraft I'd love to see for MSFS 2020 are the Lockheed Constellation and SuperConnie, the Lockheed Hercules C-130H (the most common and exported version), BoingBoing B-707, B-737-200, Douglas DC-6, DC-8, DC-9 and DC-10, C-124 Globemaster II (very ugly looking double deck military transport..seen at the end of movie Thunderball while Navy frogmen parachuted to stop the badguys!), de Havilland Canada DHC-4 Caribou and the Caribou turboprop variant, Lockheed Tristar L-1011 and SR-71 Blackbird, Airbus A310, Hughes 500D (TC's cool yellow chopper from TV show Magnum PI), UH-60 Black Hawk, Van's Aircraft RV-14 (ok yes those last two are NOT vintage in any way but that's my list!).

 

I'd also love some earlier Rutan designs, but I hear the Long EZE is already available for MSFS I think?

 

Edit: Beechcraft Model 18 and Lockheed Electra model 10 and or 12 Junior. Boeing 377 Stratocruiser and 307 Stratoliner. Someone is making a Boeing 314 Clipper for a different simulator (maybe FSX or P3D ?) but be nice in MSFS2020!

Edited by Herc79
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The Piper Arrow III by JustFlight definitely deserves mention on this thread. It's modeled after a gently used plane, not a brand new one, and does not have a glass cockpit. I like flying in it a lot.
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PMDG have anounced that they will be making all their aircraft lineup for FS2020, and while the 777 and 747 are hardly "vintage" in spirit, the Douglas DC-6 Cloudmaster most certainly is, with it's four radial powered piston props! Apparently they will, at some unknown point in future, develop that classic propliner for the new MS sim!

 

I feel that's great news for people looking for more than "ONLY" glass pit flying computers!

 

Now... looking at the definition of "vintage" gives me:

 

An item should be at least 100 years old to be defined as an antique. Generally speaking if the item is no older than an antique but not less than 20 years, it falls under the term vintage. ... It generally implies a vintage of at least fifteen or twenty years.

 

 

Which oddly enough means that the 747-400... is now... vint... vintage?!?!?

 

Which... technically... is WEIRD.

 

And then I looked up the first B-777 revenue generating flight, in 1995... also a vintee. It's weird, because I still remember the first time I saw an early B-747-100, in Pan Am colors, in 1974, those were still really new then. And the first time I saw a -400 with my own eyes, a brand new Lufthansa doing approach circuits, at CFB Lahr in 1991. I flew many places on the Canadian Air Force B-707.

 

Ok, I'm officially old.

 

Anyway, yay for the DC-6 from PMDG! Available for download 2025, maybe!

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Which oddly enough means that the 747-400... is now... vint... vintage?!?!?

 

What to say then about the Concorde?

Virtually the only supersonic airliner ever to enter service... 46 years ago!!

(Not to mention its wonderful, entirely analog cockpit)

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That's a great point, one I think we tend to overlook because it just... it looks so sleek and modern, so high tech... but yea, that really was long time ago! Heck, it wasn't yesterday that they grounded the fleet either.

 

Got to see it twice in one day, landing at CYVR, with huge vapor turbulent behind it's wings, nose down, coming in to land like some giant prehistoric robotic raptor bird... and then later that day, tiny little thing on the runway, eventually the afterburners kicked in, and then picked up some real speed and... climbing and climbing until it was out of earshot... and then out of sight.

 

Vancouver was not a regular destination for the Concorde. Not even entirely sure why it came, think it was a charter for some cruise ship tour? That was in... mby 1998 ? Apparently it did come to Vancouver in September of 1998, and then again in Oct 1999. Also two flights in 1986 for the world Expo86 event.

 

Kinda strange that they developed a working airliner to cruise at over Mach 2, just two decades after breaking the sound barrier for the first time... and today we have nothing like it.

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Kinda strange that they developed a working airliner to cruise at over Mach 2, just two decades after breaking the sound barrier for the first time... and today we have nothing like it.

 

Yep. Reminds me of what happened with Moon exploration, doesn't it?

(Sorry for the off-topic, but the example was only obvious)

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Oh of course! And btw, NASA just gave a contract today, for landing humans on le Moon, to SpaceX. I think Blue Origin thought they were going to get it, but no.

 

 

So let's consider the Concorde as vintage, which it is by definition. Most aviation geeks like me are somewhat aware of the Soviet Koncordeski, known as the Tupolev 144:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-144

 

Fewer people know that Anglo-French Concorde had such an impact on the engineers of the day, that Boeing thought the future was Mega-Boingcorde! Yes, they were planning on making the next large airliner a supersonic... SWING WING called the 2707 :

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_2707

 

They were so convinced of it, that the B-747 was more a happy mistake! See, the future was supersonic passengers. But... the US Air Force needed a heavy lift cargo plane, and asked for proposals. Boeing really wanted that contract. So they got to work on the 747 project for cargo. That iconic cockpit bump and second floor? ONLY there because they wanted an easy nose door for a cargo bay from stem to stern! Yes, they did offer passenger variant when Pan Am asked about a very large airliner (pretty sure that was in early development, but after the decision to try the USAF cargo contract), but they thought that was only going to get minimal sales until the Mega-Corde could get to service... and didn't want to spend a large amount of money on the subsonic Jumbo-Jet!

 

Lockheed offered what eventually got named the C-5A Galaxy (I think they called it an L-500 before the USAF named/designated it. ACtually nope, L-500 was a proposed civilian "Galaxy"!!), and got the USAF cargo jet contract, totalling 131 aircraft. And Boeing went on to sell 1,571 Jumbos!!

 

 

Turns out, Lockheed also wanted to make a Concorde too:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_L-2000

 

Did you ever see this movie? Airport '79

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Concorde_..._Airport_%2779

 

It's not just planes that fly... time does too!

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Most aviation geeks like me are somewhat aware of the Soviet Koncordeski, known as the Tupolev 144:

 

Yep, it existed, but only carried some 3000+ passengers on 55 flights, all domestic. Nothing to compare to the 2.5 million passengers carried by the Concorde. That's why I said "virtually the only one" :cool:

 

BTW, you're lucky to have watched a Concorde in flight. I have only managed to visit a couple times the one in exhibition at the Aeroscopia Museum in Toulouse, next to Airbus headquarters.

 

Did you ever see this movie? Airport '79

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Concorde_..._Airport_%2779

 

No, but you have piqued my interest :)

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So from what I gather, the B-747 passenger version was viewed by Boeing internally as a temporary stop-gap, to fill the void of the market, until the B-2707 would be ready for paying passengers!

 

It's kinda weird to think of what Boeing would have made if it weren't going for cargo... might they have put the cockpit up front on the main deck, and not have the hump bump???

 

You might also have heard of the 747 Tri-jet... an attempt to reduce fuel consumption on long flights with slightly fewer pax. But... they decided the engineering cost was too high, to make a "Tristar" style tail assembly. So instead they opted for extreme range and slightly higher speed, simply by removing two airframe plugs, simplifying and lightening the flaps, giving the world the stubby 747SP (Special Performance), that often cruised at MAch .93 on very long distance flights, like China to North AMerican locations, and South AFrica to European destinations while skirting around Africa.

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When I started this thread, the situation for Vintage aircraft in MSFS2020 was looking pretty grim, however as I investigate further, I'm MUCH more hopeful! It seems that FS2020 is a big sales success, more than double the original prediction, and devs are keen on serving this market.

 

Ok so a recap and significant update of the planned/announced vintage products:

 

 

 

Available now:

 

 

 

Blériot XI

(Wing42)

https://wing42.com/en/msfs-addons/29-bleriot-xi-for-msfs.html?SubmitCurrency=1&id_currency=2

 

 

 

L-19 Bird Dog

V1.6 (Black Box Simulation)

http://www.blackboxsimulation.com/index.php/products/fs2020/cessna-l19/

 

 

 

Long-EZ (Burt Rutan)

by IndiaFoxtEcho visual simulations, payware available now)

https://orbxdirect.com/product/indiafoxtecho-longez-msfs

 

 

 

MC-15 Cri-Cri

(ATSimulations)

https://atsimulations.com/cricri-msfs?fbclid=IwAR0GcF-kGqFOXtmEK-7vwOtIhtdqxkl0nEn4RpJyJWqm_pHAEm_7MhCRX1g

 

 

 

Piper Arrow III

(JustFlight ; note there is an update/patch for it, Version 0.3.0 includes a variety of fixes and improvements)

https://www.justflight.com/product/pa-28r-arrow-iii-microsoft-flight-simulator

 

 

 

Supermarine Spitfire Mk IX

(FlyingIron Simulations)

https://fselite.net/news/flyingiron-simulations-releases-spitfire-l-f-mk-ixc-for-msfs/

https://flyingironsimulations.com/products/spitfire-l-f-mk-ixc-for-microsoft-flight-simulator

 

 

 

F4U Corsair

(Milviz)

https://milviz.com/flight/products/FG1D2020/index.php

 

 

 

Grumman Goose

(freeware available now)

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/initial-release-grumman-goose-g21a-redux-ii/338063

https://www.msfsaddon.com/2020/12/msfs2020-grumman-goose-g21a-redux-ii.html

 

 

Spirit of St. Louis

(freeware available now)

http://www.allflightmods.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/msfs2020-aircraft/spirit-of-st-louis-aircraft/

 

 

 

Douglas DC-3 for MSFS2020

(freeware, no idea if any good)

http://www.allflightmods.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/msfs2020-aircraft/douglas-dc-3-for-msfs2020/

 

 

 

EA-7 Edgley Optica

(freeware, no idea if any good)

http://www.allflightmods.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/msfs2020-aircraft/ea-7-edgley-optica-v1-1/

 

 

Concorde FS2020 Conversion

(freeware, no idea if any good)

http://www.allflightmods.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-2020/msfs2020-aircraft/concorde-fs2020-conversion/

 

 

 

 

Upcoming Vintage:

 

 

 

Douglas DC-3 Dakota

(two versions are possible: Aeroplane Heaven, and PMDG internally talks about possibly adding a DC-3 Dakota, but has not yet made a decision, despite having direct access to a real Dakota owned by a friend)

https://fselite.net/previews/aeroplane-heaven-previews-dc-3-for-microsoft-flight-simulator/

 

 

 

Boeing 247D

(Wing42)

https://wing42.com/boeing-247/?v=3e8d115eb4b3

 

 

 

Douglas DC-6 Cloudmaster

(by PMDG, being the CEO’s favorite airplane in the companies hangar, Randazzo indicated that significant work has been done to bring the plane up to current standards and that, once released, users “will be blown away by the improvements” made to the product. This is not a "port" or "conversion", but rather a total overhaul of the products for FS2020, even going so far as to build new development tools and processes, to take full advantage of the potential the new sim brings)

https://forum.pmdg.com/forum/main-forum/general-discussion-news-and-announcements/119515-20mar21-a-glimpse-of-the-road-ahead

 

 

 

deHavilland DHC-6 Twin Otter

(Aerosoft, Summer of 2021)

https://fselite.net/previews/aerosoft-shares-series-of-previews-for-twin-otter-in-msfs/

https://forum.aerosoft.com/index.php?/topic/155894-aerosoft-aircraft-twin-otter/page/18/

 

 

 

deHavilland DHC-2 Beaver

(Aerosoft "Okay, I officially put a Beaver project on our project management system....")

( also MilViz is making a Beaver too, I don't believe this is a collaboration, but two different products, no dates announced)

 

 

 

B-737-200

(Milviz Inc, this is the Turbojet "Football" version, no turbofans here!)

https://stormbirds.blog/2020/08/10/the-latest-aircraft-airports-

cenery-coming-to-flight-simulator/

 

 

Boeing B-737-400

(posted on Reddit)

https://fselite.net/news/737-400-in-development-for-microsoft-flight-simulator/

 

 

 

McDonald Douglas MD-80

(Leonard Softhouse) This thread below mostly talks of a P3D version, but at the bottom they talk about being FS2020 beta testers and making a version of the MD-80 for this sim:

https://fselite.net/news/fly-the-maddog-x-64bit-update-instructor-panel-expansion-msfs-announcement/

 

 

 

McDonald Douglas MD-11

(TFDi Design)

https://fselite.net/news/tfdi-pacx-and-md-11-development-update/

https://fselite.net/previews/tfdi-design-md-11-development-update-2/

 

 

 

F-4 Phantom II (Milviz Inc)

 

 

 

Cessna T-50 (Milviz Inc)

 

 

 

Edgley Optica EA-7

(Orbx first aircraft development!)

https://stormbirds.blog/2021/04/06/orbx-lays-out-ambitious-roadmap-including-new-scenery-and-aircraft/

 

 

 

Aérospatiale/BAC Concorde

(DC Designs is making one, Aeroplane Heaven seems to be making one as well)

https://fselite.net/news/dc-designs-announces-concorde/

https://fselite.net/news/aeroplane-heaven-announces-concorde-development-for-prepar3d-and-microsoft-flight-simulator/

 

 

 

Lockheed SR-71 Blackbird

(Milviz)

https://fselite.net/news/milviz-sr-71-now-being-developed-for-msfs-instead-of-p3d/

 

 

 

Antonov An-2 "Colt"

(ATSimulations)

https://stormbirds.blog/2021/04/17/news-round-up-for-april-17th/

 

 

 

P-51 Mustang (Aeroplane Heaven)

 

 

 

Stearman Biplane (DC Designs)

 

 

 

Aerostar 600 (A2A Simulations)

 

 

 

 

Possible being discussed, but no guarantees:

 

 

 

Douglas DC-3 Dakota (PMDG)

 

 

 

Lockheed Vega (Wing42)

 

 

 

A2A is working to port over their products to MSFS2020. This would mean:

Boeing 377 Stratocruiser,

Lockheed -49 Constellation,

Boeing B-17,

P-40 Warhawk,

P-47 Razorback might happen. And possibly some others too. But no confirmations are public yet.

 

 

 

Consolidated PBY Catalina

(possibly Aerosoft. No decision has been made yet, but a port of the PBY might happen)

Edited by Herc79
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Well... considering this is a vintage topic, there would only be the Gulfstream 2 (3500 miles, that's very respectable range!), that could be considered any kind of "long range", and since there was very few private jet types in those days...

 

I guess you could maybe add long range biz jet in the old days might be a Boeing 727 with extended range tanks. I've not heard of any 727 projects for FS2020, but I'm sure there will eventually be 5 different versions, between payware lite, freeware and high fidelity payware.

 

I've not been looking for private jets for FS, so I can't answer that for you... but I also didn't see any. At all. I'm sure there's at least one or two, I just don't know of them.

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I'm more into the smaller vintage aircraft and no-one has mentioned the KINNER B-2 SPORTWING by GOLDEN AGE SIMULATIONS yet. It is listed at SimMarket (https://secure.simmarket.com/golden-age-simulations-kinner-b-2-sportwing-msfs.phtml), but oddly cannot be purchased at the moment. There are two reviews already which means it must have been available at some point, but I suspect the developer has pulled it temporarily, perhaps to address the issues mentioned in the reviews.

 

I have several GOLDEN AGE SIMULATIONS aircraft for FSX/P3D and while they lack some graphics/texture quality, they are such interesting aircraft of the 1930's era that I tend to overlook that and enjoy the uniqueness of flying some long-forgotten aircraft of the golden age of aviation.

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When I started this thread, the situation for Vintage aircraft in MSFS2020 was looking pretty grim, however as I investigate further, I'm MUCH more hopeful! It seems that FS2020 is a big sales success, more than double the original prediction, and devs are keen on serving this market.

 

Ok so a recap and significant update of the planned/announced vintage products:

 

Available now:

 

Nice list, thank you very much.

May I add these two, by MScenery?:

 

MIG 15: https://secure.simmarket.com/mscenery-mig-15-msfs.phtml

 

MCDONNELL DOUGLAS FA-18C: https://secure.simmarket.com/mscenery-mcdonnell-douglas-fa-18c-msfs.phtml

 

I don't know how good they are, but to me they LOOK good. I see the MIG is better rated in Simmarket, so I might give it a try soon... :pilot:

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Nice one! Looks like it'd be a fun flyer! Not sure I'd want to fly continental very often in such an open cockpit, but it'd be an adventure, that's for certain! I hadn't heard about this one, thank you! See, for me a big part of the benefit of FS is as you put it, "interesting aircraft", which is a major reason for my interest in vintage aviation...

 

At a certain point, glass cockpits are kinda... well, a little boring. When it comes to safety, glass cockpits are amazing and provide a HUGE amount of data in a relatively small cockpit dash. A couple years ago I went flying with a friend who built a Vans RV-10, and he used a Dynon avionics package, and since he was a beta tester for the company's new software, he had more advanced, more data, than his friends did flying Canadian Air Force Hornets and Westjet B-737-700s. It was truly amazing the data presented on his color touchscreen... collision hazards at whatever altitude we were at showed up in... pink maybe, and hazards higher were red or something, would be very very valuable for mountain flying, and especially for doing approches to landing in the mountains of BC, even moreso for go-arounds! Controlled Flight into Terrain is a very real hazard in hilly or mountainous terrain, a local politician died a couple years ago here for that very reason.

 

BUT... for training purposes, to get used to losing some or all of your avionics, be it your radios, your GPS, a power outage, pito heat failure causing ice blockage and loss of airspeed data, an antenna loss... it's nice to learn and practice on aircraft that have fewer and less complex avionics. Make do with less, to learn how to do more when some or all is taken from you. Murphy's Law states that if something can go wrong, it will go wrong at the worst possible time. So learn how to make do with less... learn how to navigate with just a map and compass, and take all the Glass bells and whistles when you are actually doing flying in hazardous locations.

 

In sim flying, it's nice to go back in time, when visibility and situational awareness was... limited at best! With anything aviation being so costly, it's amazing that we can virtually fly classic aircraft of the distant past, for less than what we pay at a fancy coffee shop in a month, having a little bit of that early aviation experience to get some idea of what that must have been like. Imagine my shock, when I suddenly realised on approach, that the PBY Catalina I was flying to a runway (it's an amphibian patrol flying boat) did not have flaps... I suddenly realised that my approach speed was possibly to fast to be guaranteed to stop before the end of the runway! So I did a go-around, and had to re-think everything, on the fly.

 

It dawned on me that maybe what I had to do was used the whole wing, the pitch of the aircraft, as my "flaps"... that is, intentionally keep my airspeed low, say just 15-20 more knots than stall speed, so that I had a fair amount of angle of attack... while not ideal, it did give me enough slow speed lift for an easy approach and touchdown, and plenty of drag to allow for a short roll-out and margin for a steep approach if needed. Initially this all pissed me off, thought the guy who made the aircraft forgot to add flaps, but then I realised it wasn't his mistake, he correctly followed the design of the real plane. All his other planes had flaps! And then I grew to love it, a quirk that required a different way of flying, that brought the uniqueness to virtual flight, that I'd not have known about, not have experienced, not have learned the history of, of one of hte most iconic planes in history, if I'd not tried that freeware PBY made by Mike Stone!

 

This is why vintage aviation appeals to me, while I also enjoy the glass cockpits, and the flying HAL9000 that is the DCS Hornet F/A-18C... (no, I'm not much good at the Hornet yet!)

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Oh definately the old Mig-15 is a vintage classic!!

 

To me, even the Mig-19 is a true vintage aircraft, and while in real life the 19 was a horrible deathtrap that Soviet pilots were probably happy to be rid of (one of the internal fuselage fuel tanks had a habbit of rupturing and catching fire from just flying about!!), those early jets were and are something amazing, pushing the limits of pilots and aerospace engineers...

 

I've never had the opportunity to see a 15, but back in 2002 I visited China, at an Eastern coastal city. One morning I heard a loud jet engine (I mean LOUD!!), so I rushed out of bed to see it, but they were gone. 10 minutes later I heard them again, and this time my window blinds were all open... and I was shocked at the jets I saw... I didn't even know what type they were, so I had to remember details. Took quite some time to nail down the type, but it seems they were the Chinese-made version of the Soviet Mig-19, with very swept back wings, giant wing fences, twin afterburning engines! To my eyes they looked pre-historic, like a flying Dinosaur! Keep in mind by that time China had already had the J-10 canard fighter, and I think they had already fielded some SU-30's by that point... so seeing such an old jet was both thrilling and confusing!

 

But then I had to keep in mind that despite being so old, the Lockheed T-33 Shooting Star is still seeing a little bit of use even today, Boeing seem to use one or more as chase-planes with cameras for test flights of their fighters and airliners, and I know the Canadian Air Force was using some for Electronic Warfare platforms for training exercises recently.

 

(Just FYI, the Mig-15 and Mig-19, along with the F-86 Sabrejet are available in DCS as well if that holds any appeal!)

 

Also, I just learned that there's a team making a KC-10 for FS2020, though I'm not sure they'll be making a civilian DC-10 alongside, I'd be surprised if they didn't do that. The KC-10 is a USAF air to air flying tanker and cargo plane (big side door on the main deck, just like Fed-Ex DC-10's and MD-10's. The MD-10 is a DC-10 that got cockpit modernisation upgrades to the old birds, and I think Fed-Ex converted all theirs to this standard).

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