Can we have a dedicated VR forum for FS 2020?

Now why would you assume that? Because if I had I would have become an instant convert? Sorry to disappoint, but once I got past the gee-whiz factor I was turned off by the low resolution and restricted field of view. Nice idea, but it's got at best a few years to go before it'll work for serious simmers.

Restriceted view??? What are you talking about...you have a 360 degree view...what do you want see into another dimension?

If it hasn't happened in the last 28 years I don't think it ever will - VR seems to be stuck with the headset and is therefore it's own worst enemy in appealing to the masses for the long term. It's great strength in my view is as a training aid for the emergency and medical services, they really should push it that way instead of into the public domain.

It has happened and it is happening. In case you haven't heard, MSFT 2020 is implementing it into the sim. Aerosoft, DCS, and flyinside have amazing VR sims RIGHT NOW. It would not surprise me if pretty soon all gaming will move to VR...sure they will still support monitors for awhile until eventually phasing them out entirely.

If it hasn't happened in the last 28 years I don't think it ever will - VR seems to be stuck with the headset and is therefore it's own worst enemy in appealing to the masses for the long term. It's great strength in my view is as a training aid for the emergency and medical services, they really should push it that way instead of into the public domain.

Once upon a time a computer took up an entire warehouse and most people couldn't envision them being small enough to have in homes, let alone a pocket. Now we have personal computers in our pockets that are just as powerful as laptops and low end desktops. And one of the advances coming from smartphones is high res, high refresh rate and low power screens that will also contribute to improving VR headsets. Be careful discounting new technology just because previous attempts failed. Light weight VR glasses with full wrap around fields of view may well be coming.

On the other hand, there are advancements elsewhere that may turn out to be even better for flight swimming at home. Check out how the recent Mandalorian TV show was filmed and picture being able to do that one day in your basement.

Once upon a time a computer took up an entire warehouse and most people couldn't envision them being small enough to have in homes, let alone a pocket. Now we have personal computers in our pockets that are just as powerful as laptops and low end desktops. And one of the advances coming from smartphones is high res, high refresh rate and low power screens that will also contribute to improving VR headsets. Be careful discounting new technology just because previous attempts failed. Light weight VR glasses with full wrap around fields of view may well be coming.

 

On the other hand, there are advancements elsewhere that may turn out to be even better for flight swimming at home. Check out how the recent Mandalorian TV show was filmed and picture being able to do that one day in your basement.

 

Exactly...everyone is acting like VR is suddenly going to stop improving. In the 80s these are the same people who were saying computers would fail...the internet wouldn't catch on...online shopping would never happen etc...

Light weight VR glasses with full wrap around fields of view may well be coming

Yes there will be great improvements in technology, but a wrap-around field of view will still effectively blindfold the wearer. VR seems to be stuck with the headset format, no matter what technology evolves over the decades. Thanks for the Mandalorian link, I think that's a technology which holds far more promise than VR.

Yes there will be great improvements in technology, but a wrap-around field of view will still effectively blindfold the wearer. VR seems to be stuck with the headset format, no matter what technology evolves over the decades. Thanks for the Mandalorian link, I think that's a technology which holds far more promise than VR.

What are you talking about???? Are you saying the problem with VR is you can't see around the room your sitting in while playing? The whole point is you are looking around the cockpit and the VR world.

Are you saying the problem with VR is you can't see around the room your sitting in while playing?

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. That was the problem back in the 90's, it's the problem today and it'll be the problem for the foreseeable future. By the way, Microsoft have NOT confirmed VR support for MSFS as reported by this VR website on Monday this week: https://www.roadtovr.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-dev-will-try-darnedest-make-vr-support-happen/

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. That was the problem back in the 90's, it's the problem today and it'll be the problem for the foreseeable future. By the way, Microsoft have NOT confirmed VR support for MSFS as reported by this VR website on Monday this week: https://www.roadtovr.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-dev-will-try-darnedest-make-vr-support-happen/

Tim,

Don't waste your time and efforts. Facts are never accepted by someone is trying to bully others into agreeing with their already made decisions!

Besides he/she may look better wearing that VR mask! ;)

Michael

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. That was the problem back in the 90's, it's the problem today and it'll be the problem for the foreseeable future. By the way, Microsoft have NOT confirmed VR support for MSFS as reported by this VR website on Monday this week: https://www.roadtovr.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-dev-will-try-darnedest-make-vr-support-happen/

I still don't get why you think that is a problem? That is the whole point of VR. I don't want to be flying around my basement...I want to be flying around Hawaii or wherever I'm at. Why would you need to see the room while you're flying around? Do you want to watch tv while you're flying?

Have you tried VR?

Tim,

 

Don't waste your time and efforts. Facts are never accepted by someone is trying to bully others into agreeing with their already made decisions!

 

Besides he/she may look better wearing that VR mask! ;)

 

Michael

What are you talking about? I'm just asking him to clarify because what he's saying doesn't make any sense.

Have you tried VR?

That would explain a lot, thanks Michael [emoji16]

It shouldn't be this difficult for anyone to accept that using VR is optional and not compulsory...

Sent from my KFDOWI using Tapatalk

Why would you need to see the room while you're flying around?

How do you read real world charts while wearing the VR gadget? How do you respond to someone coming into the room to tell you something? Do they have to come tap you on the shoulder to get your attention? How do you find the right key on the keyboard when something you need isn't on your VR panel and isn't assigned to your stick/throttle/whatever? And how do you make use of peripheral vision (yes, you can with TrackIR) in your VR gadget?

For some of us, no matter how much "immersion" we have, we still need to be able to deal with the real world outside the sim from time to time.

AND, some of us have different priorities than YOU do. Is it possible for you to understand that, or is that something else that you think shouldn't be allowed to intervene in your dream world?

If you would ease off a bit on the vituperation, and adopt a much more reasonable tone, you'd have more rewarding interactions with other folks. And that does NOT mean you have to give up on loving VR, it just means recognizing that others have valid opinions that serve them well, without expecting YOU to accede to their every whim, and you should return the favor.

How do you read real world charts while wearing the VR gadget?

It's called a virtual tablet. I don't think many pilots break out the paper maps anymore...everything is on a tablet. VR is the same.

How do you respond to someone coming into the room to tell you something? Do they have to come tap you on the shoulder to get your attention?

You still have ears lol.

How do you find the right key on the keyboard when something you need isn't on your VR panel and isn't assigned to your stick/throttle/whatever?

Do you have keyboard assignments in a real plane? Why would I need keyboard assignments in VR when all the buttons on the airplane

work? I never used keyboard assignments even with regular cockpit.

And how do you make use of peripheral vision (yes, you can with TrackIR) in your VR gadget?

Uh...you look to your left or right? Have you tried VR or what?

I think you guys need to actually try VR before trying to argue against it...you are really lobbing me up softballs here. :cool:

Have you tried VR?

I haven't. I imagine it could've been absolutely brilliant. The problem is it hasn't taken off. As it stands right now on many fronts, it needs improvements to be at a point the world would want it and not just a niche fan base as yourself. It's had more than enough time to achieve popularity but hasn't. It's no different than 3D TV. End of the day, all you can say is it really didn't succeed.

Very true, but it's surely debatable that VR is actually an advance to Flight Simulation? Headsets appear and disappear with alarming speed - buyers risk spending hundreds on a headset to find it's being discontinued before the warranty has run out. Facebook will drop its Oculus Go later this year, as reported in this article on ZDNet this week: https://www.zdnet.com/article/vendors-face-the-tough-reality-of-affordable-vr/

This is why fb is ending production of the Oculus Go...they have a newer model.

https://techcrunch.com/2020/05/18/oculus-surpasses-100-million-in-quest-content-sales/

To those who do enjoy their VR simming, by all means knock yourselves out - before VR gets banned because people keep knocking themselves out... ;)

I'm not sure how one could knock themselves out sitting in a simulator.

This just tells me you have never tried VR, and you are only going by old FAIL youtube videos. If you have tried VR today, you would know that you set up a "guardian" play area by drawing in a play space up to 25'x25' that should you leave it will suddenly bring the room into view for you. Yes it's that cool, you can actually walk around in the game now.

Here knock yourself out with this demonstration:

Tried it numerous times. Limitations remain as when it was launched, prinipaly res, field of view and sustainable frame rate..

What are any advantages, here and now?

Advantages here and now? Of course the headset fov will improve, as will the size I imagine, even though it is very comfortable as is. If everyone was like you nothing would ever improve because nobody would buy anything. Did people complain about the graphics in the commordore 64 FS? No...it was awesome at the time. We all knew that it was nothing like real life but we all played it. Now we have VR and you are quiblling over the fact that you have a tiny black border around the edge even though you can look around 360 degrees? Come on man...you know that is going to get fixed in upcoming versions. You all act like VR is going to stop evolving. As it is its better than any other options by FAR...in the coming years it will be the only option.

PEOPLE we have gone from lines on screen to SITTING INSIDE A WORKING COCKPIT SURROUNDED BY PHOTO REALISTIC SCENERY!

"Now we have VR"

We've had VR since 1994. Plenty of time to make our own choice. Some said yes, most said no. OK?

"You all act like VR is going to stop evolving."

It has stopped evolving. It still uses headsets which most people dislike and don't want to use. OK?

"Now we have VR"

We've had VR since 1994. Plenty of time to make our own choice. Some said yes, most said no. OK?

 

"You all act like VR is going to stop evolving."

It has stopped evolving. It still uses headsets which most people dislike and don't want to use. OK?

https://virtualspeech.com/blog/history-of-vr

So let's get this straight...in your opinion, VR for some reason...even though it is in THE most competitive space (gaming) and is on the cusp of mass adoption with FB touting their own VR product...is suddenly, out of nowhere, going to stop evolving? You really want to stand by that statement? You really want your place in history with the guy who doubted the internet would catch on?

even though you can look around 360 degrees?

You can do that with TrackIR, or even with a hat switch..

So let's get this straight...in your opinion, VR for some reason...even though it is in THE most competitive space (gaming) and is on the cusp of mass adoption with FB touting their own VR product...is suddenly, out of nowhere, going to stop evolving? You really want to stand by that statement? You really want your place in history with the guy who doubted the internet would catch on?

It's not my opinion, it's historical fact - VR has been 'on the cusp of mass adoption' by gamers since the early 1990's and it hasn't happened yet. Few gamers liked the headset at launch, and few like it now. The headset itself is what needs to evolve, and it obviously can't or they'd have changed it long before now. Therefore VR will only ever appeal to a minority, as it has always done, while other technologies will be developed which make VR obsolete.

It's not my opinion, it's historical fact - VR has been 'on the cusp of mass adoption' by gamers since the early 1990's and it hasn't happened yet. Few gamers liked the headset at launch, and few like it now. The headset itself is what needs to evolve, and it obviously can't or they'd have changed it long before now. Therefore VR will only ever appeal to a minority, as it has always done, while other technologies will be developed which make VR obsolete.

Well said! But again, anything that makes sense seems to be wasted when dealing with true believers! There is even an "Ark Park" in the US where a few people from all over the world come to look at a building built on a concrete foundation. Which is called "The Ark"!!

Inside these shills are told the universe is only 6,000 years old and that men kind packed dino. eggs onto the ark, so they would be "saved" from the flood as well. However even the true believers have never agreed where the "Ark" left from nor where it arrived after those "forty days and forty nights!"

Ark Park goers and many other groups of fanatics who yell at everyone else are scared to death to ever consider anything that disagrees with their closely held beliefs. The more I see and hear from VR fanatics, I tend to worry they may be as scared of facts as those who believe the universe is only 6,000 years +/- old. Or, right about now, those who preach that the current worldwide virus is just a pre election scare tactic staged by "Enemies of Freedom" to impact the presidential election results in the United States!

It's not my opinion, it's historical fact - VR has been 'on the cusp of mass adoption' by gamers since the early 1990's and it hasn't happened yet. Few gamers liked the headset at launch, and few like it now. The headset itself is what needs to evolve, and it obviously can't or they'd have changed it long before now. Therefore VR will only ever appeal to a minority, as it has always done, while other technologies will be developed which make VR obsolete.

The only thing that makes VR obsolete is a holodeck like in star trek or a real plane.

"“It honestly wasn’t our plan [to support VR], but we are listening, and we heard it, so we will try our darnedest to make it happen,” Neumann explains"

https://www.roadtovr.com/microsoft-flight-simulator-dev-will-try-darnedest-make-vr-support-happen/

There is an army of VR enthusiasts and MS is trying to accommodate us. If they don't support VR they will be the only major platform in the flight sim market who doesn't. So the questions isn't if...it's when and how good will they make it.

Well said! But again, anything that makes sense seems to be wasted when dealing with true believers! There is even an "Ark Park" in the US where a few people from all over the world come to look at a building built on a concrete foundation. Which is called "The Ark"!!

 

Inside these shills are told the universe is only 6,000 years old and that men kind packed dino. eggs onto the ark, so they would be "saved" from the flood as well. However even the true believers have never agreed where the "Ark" left from nor where it arrived after those "forty days and forty nights!"

 

Ark Park goers and many other groups of fanatics who yell at everyone else are scared to death to ever consider anything that disagrees with their closely held beliefs. The more I see and hear from VR fanatics, I tend to worry they may be as scared of facts as those who believe the universe is only 6,000 years +/- old. Or, right about now, those who preach that the current worldwide virus is just a pre election scare tactic staged by "Enemies of Freedom" to impact the presidential election results in the United States!

Hey ark park has VR! How's that for ironic?

Hey ark park has VR! How's that for ironic?

I agree!! The Ark Park and VR are equally mob mentality focused, maximum profit products!

Another dumb question, from one that has been out of sims for a long while. What is VR ???

Thanks

Rich