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Applications Demanding to be Updated


silverheels2

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Hi all:

I am writing because I am so tired of being bombarded by applications demanding for me to allow them to update themselves. My laptop, my desktop, my tablet, my phones...a constant bombardment of requests to update. It just seems unreasonable that the companies that develop and sell the software really care so much about my well being and happiness. There must be some self benefit to their gaining permission to update their software on my computer. Can someone explain to me how the developers benefit from this? My greatest fear is that they are examining my machines to obtain data on me and my life.

What are your thoughts?

BTW, I steadfastly refuse to allow them to update. Of course the worst offender by far is Win 10.

Thanks

Rick

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I can only sympathise with you Rick,

on the constant and unending updates. To me it suggests the application makers have written very poor code from the outset, or they have genuinely found an enhancement for your product/application that might serve to impress. Of course Antivirus programs are somewhat exempt from the undesirable update list (Virus definitions are part and parcel of a healthy system). Too many other programs demanding if not insisting that they have fixed another gaping hole (that an attacker/hacker/undesireable might exploit some day) and it would be to the users benefit to immediately drop everything and install without checking.

With Win updates this can lead to some significant hair pulling disasters, I like (tongue-firmly-lodged-in-cheek) the disclaimers that are now attached to such (grouped updates "Previews") that if you install the update it will break such and such or something will no-longer work but hopefully they will find a solution in a subsequent update (Oh thanks MS you really have a fine team of screw ups). I was only thinking.... as oliver twist said "have you got any more" I wonder if MS will offer me another update to play havok with my otherwise stable functioning system as I have solved all issues with the previous updates (I am bored and just live for the next opportunity to destabilise my "Zen time" on the my flight sim. Don't you just love the "Preview Optional updates" now there's an offer one can refuse (No thanks MS I'm gonna sit this one out).

I have both Win7/64/pro on my desktop Flight Sim PC and Win10/64pro on Laptop & Android Samsung mobile nothing else thank god. They all demand some update attention the mobile being the worst then Win 10 then iTunes for windows, (it seems there's a new one every week near enough to 300mb each time (nag nag nag nag ....dismiss) I can't and don't want the latest AdobeDCReader, I'm quite happy with the old AdobeReader XI but still nags me to install.. I have been dismissing it for more than 12 months now.

Which brings me to my next point, for those on limited internet data or lacking space on their system drives, this can lead to overload or paying the ISP extra for the privilege of breaking your monthly data cap, or finding you have to remove things from your system drive just to complete the update, (quite possibly inconvenient).

 

Collection of personal info - Apart from what info/data MS might already have about you as user, or your system usage habits, I doubt they are collecting any greatly identifying info during the process of updating, this all seems to happen prior to updates being offered, that's how the algorithm that defines the updates that will be pushed to your device/software are determined. (exactly what is pre-collected, hardware/software wise, I have no idea, but it is fair to say that some collected data is needed (sort of like an off the rack suit, its mostly tailored for your body size/shape but might need some fitting and adjustment) many apps require some level of input while some apps which only interact within their own defined boundaries will just push the same update to every user in an effort to have every user on near enough to the same version & patches /security. Observable benefits to the user "Who knows!!!".

So many devices and so little time or patience these days, add to my own 3 and their many software apps on those and a holler from friends and parents who say I got this update thing on my screen should I run it, is it safe what does it do, can you check, would you do it for me, because I don't understand, (does my head some times, but I still do it with a smile and hopefully good humour).

 

You are not alone

 

Cheers Jethro

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I can only sympathise with you Rick,

on the constant and unending updates. To me it suggests the application makers have written very poor code from the outset, or they have genuinely found an enhancement for your product/application that might serve to impress. Of course Antivirus programs are somewhat exempt from the undesirable update list (Virus definitions are part and parcel of a healthy system). Too many other programs demanding if not insisting that they have fixed another gaping hole (that an attacker/hacker/undesireable might exploit some day) and it would be to the users benefit to immediately drop everything and install without checking.

With Win updates this can lead to some significant hair pulling disasters, I like (tongue-firmly-lodged-in-cheek) the disclaimers that are now attached to such (grouped updates "Previews") that if you install the update it will break such and such or something will no-longer work but hopefully they will find a solution in a subsequent update (Oh thanks MS you really have a fine team of screw ups). I was only thinking.... as oliver twist said "have you got any more" I wonder if MS will offer me another update to play havok with my otherwise stable functioning system as I have solved all issues with the previous updates (I am bored and just live for the next opportunity to destabilise my "Zen time" on the my flight sim. Don't you just love the "Preview Optional updates" now there's an offer one can refuse (No thanks MS I'm gonna sit this one out).

I have both Win7/64/pro on my desktop Flight Sim PC and Win10/64pro on Laptop & Android Samsung mobile nothing else thank god. They all demand some update attention the mobile being the worst then Win 10 then iTunes for windows, (it seems there's a new one every week near enough to 300mb each time (nag nag nag nag ....dismiss) I can't and don't want the latest AdobeDCReader, I'm quite happy with the old AdobeReader XI but still nags me to install.. I have been dismissing it for more than 12 months now.

Which brings me to my next point, for those on limited internet data or lacking space on their system drives, this can lead to overload or paying the ISP extra for the privilege of breaking your monthly data cap, or finding you have to remove things from your system drive just to complete the update, (quite possibly inconvenient).

 

Collection of personal info - Apart from what info/data MS might already have about you as user, or your system usage habits, I doubt they are collecting any greatly identifying info during the process of updating, this all seems to happen prior to updates being offered, that's how the algorithm that defines the updates that will be pushed to your device/software are determined. (exactly what is pre-collected, hardware/software wise, I have no idea, but it is fair to say that some collected data is needed (sort of like an off the rack suit, its mostly tailored for your body size/shape but might need some fitting and adjustment) many apps require some level of input while some apps which only interact within their own defined boundaries will just push the same update to every user in an effort to have every user on near enough to the same version & patches /security. Observable benefits to the user "Who knows!!!".

So many devices and so little time or patience these days, add to my own 3 and their many software apps on those and a holler from friends and parents who say I got this update thing on my screen should I run it, is it safe what does it do, can you check, would you do it for me, because I don't understand, (does my head some times, but I still do it with a smile and hopefully good humour).

 

You are not alone

 

Cheers Jethro

 

Thanks Jethro for the detailed response, which I re-read 3 times! I don't use anti-virus programs. I have as you do a sim computer with Win 7 64 installed, and I have ALL updates turned off. That machine is hooked to the web maybe 30 seconds a day when I download the ASN weather for the day's flying. after the download I disable the network interface. I've been doing that for at least 18 years with no problems. On my laptop, which runs Win 10 (ugh), I have it set to "metered connection" to ward off MS attacks to update, and deny everyone permission to update. The laptop is 2 years old and no issues. The damn Android fones drive me nuts. Constant attacks by Google are extremely annoying. When my current contract ends I am retrograding to my reliable flip phone. I can live without 24/7 web access. Mark my words, they are killing the goose that laid the golden egg. By the way, never sign up for any service that require you to "register", or "open an account".

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With the exception of antivirus and, yes, Windows, I follow the axiom "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". In most of my programs on the PC, there is a settings' or 'options' selection available. Most require you to then select 'advanced' and somewhere in there you can change your update options. I'm kinda new to Smartphones and can't help much there.
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Yes it can be tiresome to update, but I only get such messages on my mobile phone (iPhone). Now and then I push the button "Update all" in the app store, and all apps are updated. For me is updates a sign of a living app. Somebody is active with development and enhancement of the app.

 

On the PC I never get updates, besides Windows 10. And I always do update immediately. I think it's not wise to postpone such. If you are willing to take risk with no updates, it's up to you, but I don't see any benefits of not updating. I always do this when I switch of the PC. Next time I switch on the PC, the downloaded updates are installed. Sometimes this takes a while, but for me it's not a big problem.

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With the exception of antivirus and, yes, Windows, I follow the axiom "If it ain't broke, don't fix it". In most of my programs on the PC, there is a settings' or 'options' selection available. Most require you to then select 'advanced' and somewhere in there you can change your update options. I'm kinda new to Smartphones and can't help much there.

 

That is exactly how I operate. I still would like to understand how app developers benefit from updating. Maybe it is just good business to have the installed base at the same level?

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If you are an app developer I assume you want the update is for some tool you are using for developing apps. And to get bug fixes, because all software have bugs!

 

If you are an "ordinate" user, you are also mostly interested to get bugs fixed. And maybe some new feature.

 

But of course if you are not interested in bug fixes, and new features, you don't have to update.

I assume are there still many Windows XP computer used.

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Constant updates piss me off and I wonder on a almost daily basis how people put up with it. Here's the real kicker. I have Comcast cable with the so-called "X1 platform." What a flipping joke! Not only does the signal cut out every once in a while and some channels mess up, but the boxes, both of them in the house update every night at about 3AM. while this process happens I can't watch the TV until it completes. And I have to also wait for the second box to update as it disables my TV as well when it updates. Talk about totally excessive. It's worse than win 10! Is a product that broken?

 

I don't use 10 for a whole slew of reasons. Chiefly the forced updates, the built-in keylogger and its analytics gathering and creating a portfolio on you. I even stopped using Skype when it now isn't p2p like it used to be ever since M$ took over. I now run my own TeamSpeak server.

 

Updates in programs can be disabled in their options. I do that and then chose to update when I feel like it. I personally like control of what I do. Another reason why I refuse to use 10.

 

As to Smartphones, it's basically this: Update, update, update, update. Notification, notification, notification, notification. That's about it and it's a marketers wet dream come true. You DO NOT have any privacy with a smartphone. That I can guarantee you. Unless you buy a Black phone from Silent Circle and never EVER use Google Apps.

 

As to privacy with updates and all that rot. They obviously collect your IP address as you fetch the update. Depending on what you have installed it could mean statistics as well. For a smartphone there are firewall Apps. I have such installed on my phone called No root Firewall. It's alright I guess. Does what it claims, but it has to install as a VPN and if you use a VPN in your phone that might cause a problem. Also, you need to make sure certain components do allow Internet access. Basically, with a smartphone, no matter how you look at it you lose privacy whether you like it or not. Once again, check out Black Phone. Pretty damn costly, but you don't get to use Google Apps. It's the price you pay for privacy. After all, Google, M$, etc ALL collect statistics.

 

As to Winblows 10. I'd personally use a hardware-based firewall like PFsense or Untangle and thin clients with that already installed can be found at eBay. There are others. You can go here: http://bgp.he.net/ and grab all of Microsoft's ASNs and block them in the firewall for in/out traffic. But this means no updates, etc. I don't use updates in my Win 7 machines at all and I'm still going strong. I've never been hacked, never got malware or any of that crap foretold by those that say if you don't update you're "vulnerable." The main reason is because I don't browse the Internet like an idiot and/or download suspicious crap. And all downloads are either checked with their provided hashes and/or uploaded to Virus Total. If you pirate, good luck with that. Right now I also use a whole disk sand boxing program called Fortres Security Clean Slate. I have loaded malware and even Cryptolocker onto the machine and once rebooted all was gone. I would argue that a whole disk sand boxing programs like Clean Slate or Deep Freeze is well worth the money over any anti-virus program. Of course you could run an anti-virus program along side of it. I prefer Bitdefender Free. It's cloud-based, light weight and not full of bloat. The only issue with whole disk visualization is that you have to make several exceptions like the recycle bin path, your documents, downloads, browser paths, desktop, etc. But it's all well worth t for the protection it affords.

 

If I had to use a in 10 laptop, I'd internet in a virtual machine using VMware Workstation Player with win 7 installed into it.

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I agree with the above, I hate when I'm in the middle of something then get an popup asking/telling me there is an update for such and such program, it just seems funny they only popup then and not when the PC boots up or it's idle.

 

@silerheels2

You broke your rule when you logged in on here and typed your post lol. :)

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I agree with the above, I hate when I'm in the middle of something then get an popup asking/telling me there is an update for such and such program, it just seems funny they only popup then and not when the PC boots up or it's idle.

 

@silerheels2

You broke your rule when you logged in on here and typed your post lol. :)

 

Sorry, I don't get it????

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Colin is referring to your statement made at the end of post #3

 

''By the way, never sign up for any service that require you to "register", or "open an account".

 

Thank you. Now I get it. However, the apps I have looked at want not only your email, but also "..a telephone number..". They want the telephone number so they can sell it to a universe of sources who want to sell, solicit donation, and solicit opinions. This results in my phone alarming at all hours followed by a click then some automated voice saying "...hello (given name) aren't you tired of your...."

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I haven't read all the comments in this tread, but I'm wander why some of you really use Internet at all? You get annoyed by getting message to update, annoyed by register pages asking questions etc.

 

I'm not sure if use Facebook, Twitter, Instagram etc, or use the Chrome browser. All these are collecting information about you. Which I'm aware of, but I can live with that. You don't have to reveal more information than is necessary. If companies know what pages you surf to, in order to send me offers, it's not a big deal for me. Besides the Firefox and I assume other browsers also, have options you can switch on, to stops some of this information gathering.

 

This is how the Internet works. There are drawbacks, but for me the benefits outweighs.

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I haven't read all the comments in this tread, but I'm wander why some of you really use Internet at all? You get annoyed by getting message to update, annoyed by register pages asking questions etc.

 

I'm not sure if use Facebook, Twitter, Instagram etc, or use the Chrome browser. All these are collecting information about you. Which I'm aware of, but I can live with that. You don't have to reveal more information than is necessary. If companies know what pages you surf to, in order to send me offers, it's not a big deal for me. Besides the Firefox and I assume other browsers also, have options you can switch on, to stops some of this information gathering.

 

This is how the Internet works. There are drawbacks, but for me the benefits outweighs.

 

Correct Msiipola,

These days I am finding very little benefit in having an internet connection at all, I liken it to the garbage programs on TV, even the news seems contrived for advertisers these days, yes even cable/satellite TV's lineup of repeat rubbish seen many times before. Virtual flying will just have to do as TV is not so good anymore. I would go bush if only I didn't want to maintain my few electronic connections and beloved Flight sim.

Internet access for Flight simulation & software / news & Flight simulation forums are where my interests have always been, my desire to help someone with technical issues is where having internet access and the ability to communicate a potential solution.

I used to order DVD's for products I was interested in, but we now live in a near fully digital download era, Downloads are huge and require a good internet speed & capacity, along with a secure functional healthy machine. Some programs will not function unless internet connected (they require licenced ID each time they start or are loaded as a utility for FS) not for me I don't like the fact that the primary program "FS" can be stifled by an addon requiring access but could be denied by the server owner or internet, ISP generally. For this reason no steam apps for me no icloud or any other cloud service, no Dropbox, too damn modern and risky I don't want my personal files kept or served by such unknown insecure entities who would sell your stuff to the highest bidder if they thought you could do nothing to prevent such a breech legally under their TOS. Let alone being hacked, which are literally the least of our problems, we have more to fear from those who do it legally because you the user clicked on the "Agree" button even after reading the terms, but had to proceed signing away your rights in order to use the device or software. So go ahead and click the Agree button anyway they say, we are nice people who would never harm you or ever allow security breach or sell your info beyond what you agreed in the TOS. (Ever read or fully understood the legal doublespeak in the binding "Terms of Service", btw a TOS agreement is completely different thing to a more trustworthy EULA, "Trust" me, when the terms change you will have no rights over your current info (they own it, or at least possess it), to do what they will, you have the option then to discontinue using the device or software or continue under the "new terms" even though they might not read to be in your best interests but serve the companies greater desire to erode your former rights. (Whata choice)

The company could change hands, suffer financial loss and therefore spend little on your personal data security kept in their possession, or just pass you off to the highest unknown bidder.

 

Good luck with FB, Twitter, Instagram, and other social media platforms, I do not use any of them, I have no desire to expose my personal life to data collectors / onsellers.

One day when you have surrendered enough metadata, actual data, biometric data, iris scans, face recognition data, passport data, fingerprint data, linked account login info, personal pictures of yourself friends & family, you will be owned lock stock and barrel, your financial transactions, your level of debt/credit, health history, internet historys /searches tracked at every point, cctv will find you and record your movements in an (Orwellian nightmare) if trackers loose your last known position they can simply follow the last transaction or internet action gps location and so on..... What is your security worth to you. All might be little too late for some for the sake of perceived benefits.

Need I say more. My profile exposure is extremely low, personal info is kept to an absolute minimum, I pay in cash, I do not travel any more or have a current passport.

 

There are never enough benefits to outweigh the ever increasing downsides. I want my freedom intact, to live peacefully and unobserved, nobody owns my info, although once entered the www and social media will lay perpetual claim to your personal info to cross reference on large database super computers.

 

Welcome to a new world of pain.

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Correct Msiipola,

These days I am finding very little benefit in having an internet connection at all, I liken it to the garbage programs on TV, even the news seems contrived for advertisers these days, yes even cable/satellite TV's lineup of repeat rubbish seen many times before. Virtual flying will just have to do as TV is not so good anymore. I would go bush if only I didn't want to maintain my few electronic connections and beloved Flight sim.

Internet access for Flight simulation & software / news & Flight simulation forums are where my interests have always been, my desire to help someone with technical issues is where having internet access and the ability to communicate a potential solution.

I used to order DVD's for products I was interested in, but we now live in a near fully digital download era, Downloads are huge and require a good internet speed & capacity, along with a secure functional healthy machine. Some programs will not function unless internet connected (they require licenced ID each time they start or are loaded as a utility for FS) not for me I don't like the fact that the primary program "FS" can be stifled by an addon requiring access but could be denied by the server owner or internet, ISP generally. For this reason no steam apps for me no icloud or any other cloud service, no Dropbox, too damn modern and risky I don't want my personal files kept or served by such unknown insecure entities who would sell your stuff to the highest bidder if they thought you could do nothing to prevent such a breech legally under their TOS. Let alone being hacked, which are literally the least of our problems, we have more to fear from those who do it legally because you the user clicked on the "Agree" button even after reading the terms, but had to proceed signing away your rights in order to use the device or software. So go ahead and click the Agree button anyway they say, we are nice people who would never harm you or ever allow security breach or sell your info beyond what you agreed in the TOS. (Ever read or fully understood the legal doublespeak in the binding "Terms of Service", btw a TOS agreement is completely different thing to a more trustworthy EULA, "Trust" me, when the terms change you will have no rights over your current info (they own it, or at least possess it), to do what they will, you have the option then to discontinue using the device or software or continue under the "new terms" even though they might not read to be in your best interests but serve the companies greater desire to erode your former rights. (Whata choice)

The company could change hands, suffer financial loss and therefore spend little on your personal data security kept in their possession, or just pass you off to the highest unknown bidder.

 

Good luck with FB, Twitter, Instagram, and other social media platforms, I do not use any of them, I have no desire to expose my personal life to data collectors / onsellers.

One day when you have surrendered enough metadata, actual data, biometric data, iris scans, face recognition data, passport data, fingerprint data, linked account login info, personal pictures of yourself friends & family, you will be owned lock stock and barrel, your financial transactions, your level of debt/credit, health history, internet historys /searches tracked at every point, cctv will find you and record your movements in an (Orwellian nightmare) if trackers loose your last known position they can simply follow the last transaction or internet action gps location and so on..... What is your security worth to you. All might be little too late for some for the sake of perceived benefits.

Need I say more. My profile exposure is extremely low, personal info is kept to an absolute minimum, I pay in cash, I do not travel any more or have a current passport.

 

There are never enough benefits to outweigh the ever increasing downsides. I want my freedom intact, to live peacefully and unobserved, nobody owns my info, although once entered the www and social media will lay perpetual claim to your personal info to cross reference on large database super computers.

 

Welcome to a new world of pain.

 

Well said Jethrom

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