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Thread: DC-8 Panel Preview-updated!!

  1. Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    Yup, I really dislike that view. I remember how pleased I was "back in the day" when you guys released the DF734 with the perspective seen from the captain seat and not the throttle pedestal and of course the first real FS FMC. This new and upcoming release is the most exciting add on since the DF727, my number 1 AC for FS, and I´m most grateful that we have a talented team led by you Paul to make this baby.

    By the way Paul, I remember you referring to the fact that the ACES team had left some important pieces out of FS10 that higly complex add ons use. Has or Is this affecting the DC8 project?

    Kind Regards

    Jon T.

  2. Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    Hi Jon, I was probably referring to the way the views section of the panel.cfg has changed........well, actually been removed. Apart no longer being able to use the photoreal sideviews, this means the option to have "no VC" models has gone as it's now the VC that provides the sideview.

    Also, in the past we've used some of the stranger 2d views (like upper forward left etc) to create alternative forward views, like for the FO. The loss of all but one fixed view affects the alternative views too.

    Fortunately, whilst the methodolgy may be different, we are still able to add multiple forward views and of course, the addition of the fixed camera views for both spot view and the VC makes for some very interesting opportunities.

    Has it affected the DC-8? Only by virtue of the fact I've been looking at the 727 :-( The DC-8 is being created for FSX, though that will of course be reviewed as it progresses as it ultimately will depend on FSX being updated to the point where the majority want to use it.
    Cheers

    Paul Golding
    Dreamfleet/Flight1 727 & 727X Developer

  3. #13

    Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    I'd like to post a comment on FSX and it's use of the VC for side views.

    Often I've noticed that when I use the 2D panel in FS2004, and then switch to the VC (or if I'm using a setup where the VC replaces the photo 2D side views), than the textures on the virtual cockpit have to 'reload' after a few seconds back on the 2D panel. I notice this on the DF727, hence I will choose the photo 2D side views to stop that constant reloading when I look out the windows.

    My primary aim in posting this is to point out that with clever texture UV layout during the modeling stages, it is possible to completely solve this issue.

    Notice that when looking to the rear (or from wingviews) that the wing textures never have to reload? This part of the model is always textured when the 2D panel is loaded, you can see this when you are flying the no VC/no 2D sideview 727 model, and looking back the wings and parts back there are always textured and never have to load. Switch back to the VC, and again the VC starts untextured as they load again.

    This has been solved in my experience building and UV mapping FS2004 models, by simply adding a single polygon triangle on the bottom side of the wings which calls the texture for the VC into memory. If there are 5 VC textures, do this same thing 5 times on different triangles. Now when I switch back to the VC, the textures are 'pre-loaded' and will immediately appear with no waits.

    Of course there is a penalty of having all the VC textures in memory all the time, but I will accept this in place of the textures constantly being reloaded, which certainly breaks the immersion and makes looking out the side windows less pleasant.

    Perhaps a very important trick since FSX will require the VC and it's textures for any side views.

  4. #14

    Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    >I'm still waiting for someone to point out what's wrong with
    >the MSFS style panel view though ;-)

    Hi Paul,

    First a Happy New Year to you and your family.

    Those panel previews are just stunning !!!

    The only thing that comes to mind about what can be wrong with the MSFS view, is that the window poles are in a wrong perspective. In a jumpseat position, the posts should be more like a V. The way the are now, you used the pilot position photo, and used the post in a jumpseat position. Then you mirrored the left post, and pasted it as the right post.

    Other than that, I love a jumpseat view as an "overall view" of the panel, which I use a lot in combination with a "captain view".

    Even if I still have FSX installed, I really hope that the DC8 will be for FS9. ;-)

    Take care,

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  5. Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    >Hi Jon, I was probably referring to the way the views section
    >of the panel.cfg has changed........well, actually been
    >removed. Apart no longer being able to use the photoreal
    >sideviews, this means the option to have "no VC" models has
    >gone as it's now the VC that provides the sideview.

    Alas, everything I'm reading about FSX...and what you have just stated, above, Paul is, in a way, an obituary for me..."He flew...but died when the candy crashed his wallet...and FPS" S-I-G-H!

    >Has it affected the DC-8? Only by virtue of the fact I've
    >been looking at the 727 :-( The DC-8 is being created for
    >FSX, though that will of course be reviewed as it progresses
    >as it ultimately will depend on FSX being updated to the point
    >where the majority want to use it.

    Hey, HEY...not going to use FSX! Hello!?! Hey!, over here! Yeah, over here...not going to use FSX!!

    LOL! Sorry, Paul...I just couldn't resist. SO...in a more serious vein...and somber, as well...should I just resign myself to the fact that I'll not be getting anymore of what has been my fave aircraft from DreamFleet? Cuz I ain't doing FSX anytime soon, if ever...probably never, for reasons I've stated here before (let's not go into that again, eh?). I'm comfortable with using only the FS9 DF offerings...but I'll always wonder what "could have been" if the VC/Gamers croud had not had such an apparently strong voice in the decisions made at MS? Did they not read the forums? Ah, heck...they probably did and decided the trade-off between losing a few 2D hardcore's versus gaining a bunch of eye-candy addicts and GAMERS (UGHHhhhh!!!) was worth it. I am doing my part to prove them wrong....for what THAT'S worth (squat). LOL!

    It has been a pleasant journey and I have always appreciated DF's kind and personal service...even when I was having "brain farts"! Since I doubt that FSX will ever be "updated to the point where "I" want to use it" I'll wish you all the best, now. DF has always provided a quality product and I doubt that will change. This is one of the things I've dreaded, since finding out just how much MS has ignored us 2D'ers...saying goodbye to the developers of payware and freeware that I have religiously used in the past.

    I KNOW..."VC is the way"..."It's the wave of the future!" Yadda, yadda, yadda. I have exactly 1 {ONE} aircraft (out of 87) I'll fly in VC...the Christen Eagle aerobatic biplane...that's it.

    OK...enough "sour grapes", eh? Hey...you guys will make the best addons for FSX, I have no doubt. Your commitment to quality and "reality" is legendary and I can attest to it, wholeheartedly. I'm gonna miss my chance at the DC8...and I STILL think you should do the 707...who's gonna do it better??? Who else can bring the "Princess of the Jet Age" to life?? Eh?? Nobody can do it better, AFAIC.

    Take care, gang, and be well. I'll miss your kind support and patient understanding...and I'll DAMN sure miss the great new aircraft (S-I-G-H!).

    "May all your addons work like a DF 727"
    Me, today.

    Vic

  6. Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    I'm with you over the 2d panel issue Vic, I bug reported over and again, but at the end of the day, MS said it had to be a trade-off; lots of cool new stuff like multiple forward views and camera angles, or the fixed view 2d windows we had in the past.

    At the end of the day, it's no big loss.............providing the VC can be made to look as good as a 2d photoreal bitmap.

    The fact that a VC is required for the side views, doesn't mean you have to use it for the forward view of course. I know I rarely do!

    And being able to use the keyboard for swaping between multiple forward views with any hassle with other pop-up panels is really quite nice. The DC-8 could well have 7 different forward view options (of the same panel), all toggleable or clickable.

    All that said, I know Lou's next release is for FS9, and as I've said before, we'll take a look at what's happening a bit closer to when the DC-8 is ready and decide then if it's worth doing it for 2 different versions of FS.

    Yeah, I know I need to do a 707 ;-)


    Cheers

    Paul Golding
    Dreamfleet/Flight1 727 & 727X Developer

  7. #17

    Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview!!

    From the little I've seen of FSX, the VCs often look the same as the 2D panels (maybe they've fixed the lighting?). Could you make a simple VC, simply consisting of seven polygons arranged around the captain's head, with the conventional 2D views as the textures on it?

    (Although, by the time I get FSX (estimated to occur at some point in 2009) I should have a TrackIR4 and will be 6DoFing around the VC like a rabid weasel.)

    EDIT: How come I hadn't seen those preview before? They look very good!

    Just one suggestion - can there be a version of the panel in 1960s condition, without TCAS or other LCD instruments?

  8. #18

    Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview-updated!!

    paul that panel looks good so far, however i'm missing the "DF Style" perspective, cause that made your panels always unique ;(

  9. Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview-updated!!

    Maybe you didn't read what I said?

    The first pic is an example of the "nasty" MSFS view, the second is the FO VFR view..............what do you think is missing?

    In addition, there will be Capt IFR, Capt VFR, FO IFR and maybe some landing panels too. All of which (aside from the MSFS view) give the pilot (or FO) view.
    Cheers

    Paul Golding
    Dreamfleet/Flight1 727 & 727X Developer

  10. #20
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    Default RE: DC-8 Panel Preview-updated!!

    Hi Paul,
    Sitting here in IAD waiting for improved braking action at our destination (KSHD). Absolutely, fantastic looking DC-8 panel! I'm really looking foward to your finished product, I regreat having little time these days for much simming though. However, I am always interested in teh newest developments.
    In other news, my company Colgan Air was purchased by Pinnacle Airlines. Things are a little tense here, because they are ALPA and we are non-union. Rumors are that we will be getting 30 DHC-8-400Qs, and the Beech will be gone in a year or after our EAS contracts expire. I'm going through check airman training on the Beech, so we'll see how long till I am on the DASH!

    Regards,

    Scott Fitzpatrick
    Draper, VA

    P.S. Say hello Lou and have him drop me a note. I'll be in LGA for seat-specific training in a couple of weeks.

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