Three Questions :O

[Fitzwilliam]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 11:31AM (EST)[/font][p]TAKE-OFF PITCH is pitching me off! :)

1. When the nosewheel starts lifting off the runway and I rotate to take-off pitch, is there any way to tell how many degrees up I am pitching?

I try to make a guess at where to position the joystick, but usually I am off and end up having to compensate once I am in the air and the pitch is suddenly shown on the attitude indicator. Now I am not a pilot, but wouldn’t some kind of gauge that tells you the degrees you are pitching following your take-off roll be helpful? :) I do not like ‘guesstimating’ because my guess could be off and I might end up stalling and ending up like the Space Shuttle… glued to the back of a 747…

2. How can you set trim before take-off so that it is in the ballpark? I have yet to be able to ease backpressure off by trimming…usually it involves holding the joystick and slamming the trim down for a minute until it finally gets in the right place :) Now, granted, my anger management course is beneficial… but who would not torch the aircraft when dealing with such intractable trim?

3. Autopilot: when do you use it, in general? I have yet to turn it on and cannot find any best practices for its use… also; I think mine might be broken, because when I press the button no inflatable pilot pops up to take over …

Thank you!

[Buchek]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 11:39AM (EST)[/font][p]>> "...when I press the button no inflatable pilot pops up to take over ..."

May be air pressure has not build up strong enough shortly after take off........ :-lol

Actually i'm programming the auto pilot before take off for the right altitude and heading. After take off first establish a stable climb, which after initial climb must lead in a climb rate near the auto pilots default rate (depends on the aircraft) or in your programmed vertical speed (if programmable). After climb is stable (and checklists are done) engage auto pilot.

Regarding your problem with pitch: most artificial horizon indicators, especially those for the big iron, do have degree markers which are provided with readable digits. Without digits it depends on the gauge....

Hope this helps a bit.

Cheers,
Hank

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Pentium 4 2GHZ
512 M DDR-RAM
MSI Geforce 4 TI4200
3dBench 9248 Pts.
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[salmendra]

1) Bucheck is pretty correct. If my gauge doesn´t show trim settings i usually hold it for 2 or 3 seconds (no science in that just a guess.

2) Again Buchek is correct. Just notice that you SET the alt. but does not engage A/P before starting the t/o roll. If you engage it on the groun you the a/p will try to lift you into the air by putting nose up trim to max. When you indeed take off you´ll reach a 7000 FPM climb and probably stall (from your description I think that´s the problem you have).

3) Again Buchek is pretty right. See my comments above. Regarding the inflatable pilot, contact Microsoft and request a fresh FS CD or download a patch. BTW my FS copy has come with a beautiful brunette.

regards

Sergio Almendra
Curitiba - Brazil

[artgeverding]

You asked -

2. How can you set trim before take-off so that it is in the ballpark? No - this is not a snarky reply but if you are looking for the ballpark and have not found it perhaps you are unaware that most aircraft -default and payware have a trim/pitch indicator somewhere on the panel as they do in real life. It is a quirk with FS2002 that starts a first loaded aircraft in a rather high pitch up atitude which has one ballon up on takeoff. Bring the indicator down to at least the mid point sometimes seen as TO as in takeoff. Some require that you go even a bit below this point. This will put you in the ballpark and make for smooth realistic rotations and climbouts with just small further changes to achieve the desired best angle or best rate of climb for the particular aircraft.

Art

[flyinggriffin]

The attitude indicator will show you the number of degrees that the airplane is pitched up.

As far as how much to pull back on the yoke? Go out and shoot some stop and gos. See how far back you have to pull back and just remember this. Besides, you have the A.I. to tell you when to relax pitch.

[lnuss]

There are certainly some helpful posts above, but I'd especially like to discuss #1 above.

Part of your problem is trying to "position the joystick." An aircraft doesn't know anything about the joystick position. And in a light aircraft, worrying about the number of degrees of pitch for takeoff can be distracting. What you are actually looking for is two things: 1) How much initial back pressure does it take to get the nosewheel clear of the ground, and 2) what does it look like, preferably out the window? On part 1), you'll want the trim at a takeoff setting -- I'll discuss that in a minute.

A complicating factor in how much back pressure (not stick movement) you'll want is that the moment the nosewheel leaves the ground, the required pressure will change. How much and which direction will depend, among other things, on how the trim is set and which specific aircraft you are flying, as well as what your attempted rotation speed is. You may have to add a tad more pressure or, since airspeed is increasing, you may have to relax the pressure a little, just to maintain a constant pitch. You need to learn to use pressure changes on the controls to change what you see to what you want it to look like, forgetting about what position anything is in. The nose is too low? Then add a touch of back pressure. Not enough? Add a touch more. Too much, relax the pressure a tad.

After liftoff, you may need to lower the nose slightly until reaching climb speed, then add more back pressure to maintain that attitude for climb speed. After reaching about 400-500 AGL on your initial climb, bring the manifold pressure back to 25", or so, and bring the RPM back to 2500 (on aircraft that run up to higher RPMs). On later model C182s (and I think it applies to the one in FS), max RPM is 2400, so you can just leave it there after retarding the throttle.

As mentioned above, most FS aircraft have some sort of trim indicator. On the C182 you'll want to try it initially with the trim centered, that is, no nose up or nose down trim. After a few tries, you may find it works better for you to adjust it slightly nose up or slightly nose down (not very much, though, or you'll wind up overcontrolling at some point). Once you've found the trim point you prefer, set the aircraft at your intended flight startup location, with the trim set properly and other parameters the way you like, then save the flight and make it the default.

A good way to get a feel for what is going on (with FS, of course) is to get in the spot view after lining up for takeoff, get in a view from the 3 o'clock or 9 o'clock position and observe the nosewheel as you roll down the runway, and especially as you are raising the nose. Raise the nose about a foot off the ground (estimating scale, obviously). You can then see exactly what results are occurring with a particular amount of pressure, and you'll also see what happens if you don't make constant adjustments in that pressure. Then you can take your new-found knowledge back into the cockpit.

Another hint: If your joystick allows, set an axis for the elevator trim. Your flying will become MUCH smoother. My Saitek X-36 (the X-45 is similar) has six different controls that can be set to an axis: Ailerons, elevator and rudder (a rocker switch), of course, along with the throttle. But there are also two rotary controls, each with a center detent, one of which falls under my thumb on the throttle and that I have set to elevator trim. The other one is near the tip of my index finger on the throttle, and I have it set to control spoilers (very helpful on jets and gliders). Hat switches for view control help, too.

One last comment: I'd forget about the autopilot until you have mastered the basics, then come back here for further instruction on it.

[HR]
Larry N.

http://www.flightsim.com/dcforum/Use...7454c071bd.jpg

[lsdunch]

Love reading your responses, Larry. Always clear, helpful and interesting :-)

Liam S. Dunch
Ex-pat Aussie
Tour Manager, Collette Vacations

[salmendra]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Jan-28-03 AT 03:25PM (EST)[/font][p]Larry

I was just thinking PM-ing you to give a help here (but didn´t wanted to force you in). Re-reading my attempt of help I noticed a real pro was neeeded. BTW I wil aslo benefit from your tip on using spot view to judge the stick pressure.

Regards.

Sergio Almendra
Curitiba - Brazil

[Fitzwilliam]

Great information! Thank you all for taking the time to respond :)

[napamule]

I think the suggestion to hold trim adj (num pad '1') for 2 or 3 seconds is the most practical. When I first flew using FS2002 I was surprised by how my AC's did a nose dive if I let go of my joy.
Since then I find that giving it plenty of 'up' trim (over-compensated), such as 10 to 15 presses of num pad '1', would allow for easy rotation, and nose up for climb, without too much input from joy.
It is inevitably 'too much', but hitting num pad '7' six or seven times usually corrects it. I then go to AP, or watch how sensitive to trim that particular AC is (they ALL SEEM TO BE DIFFERENT) from SPOT view.
Pitch trim makes VFR flying easier. It also is inportant if you want to control AC's attitude when landing. Pitch Trim, to me, is the single most inportant factor in consistant, and successful, approach/landing of ALL the FS2k2 AC's, not just the heavy metal.
Learn using pitch trim, and you can make an F-18 fly at 90 kts, level, and forever (with full flaps, and spoiler deployed, little or no throttle). In other words, it's impossible if you try to use only your joy to do this. Regards.
napamule