Prepare3D

Hi All,

 

Let me begin with acknowledging that there are many threads all over the internet about this very topic and I have done much research about it. I don't really want this turning into a debate as I know its a contentious issue, I would however, appreciate some advice and knowledge on the topic. I have two parts to this thread so bare with me if you have the time.

 

I'll start by providing my system specs:

 

Asus Sabertooth 990FX motherboard

AMD FX9590 4.7 GHz processor (watercooled)

EVGA GTX 980Ti Hybrid (watercooled)

500Gb Samsung evo 850 SSD

16 GB DDR3 RAM

Corsair HX1200i PSU

Windows 7 Home Premium 64x

FSX Delux with Acceleration

 

 

Part 1:

 

I have completed Kosta's tweaks for FSX and used 2 airports (KJFK default and YSSY Fly Tampa) for a small test.

 

At the default KJFK with 100% WoAI traffic my FPS are between 20-35. With 0% traffic my FPS are between 30-40. I am happy with these framerates.

 

However:

 

At FlyTampa Sydney and using ORBX Au scenery, with 100% WoAI Traffic my FPS sit between 10-20. Same airport with 0% traffic my FPS increases to between 15-30. I believe I have a fairly decent high-end PC and I can't help but think I should be getting more FPS. My first question is; while FSX is playable like this, is this the most performance I can expect out of FSX on the system I have?

 

Part 2:

 

I have done a fair bit of research on P3D but I would like clarification on some main issues that are important to me on FSX:

 

-Most payware aircraft models (PMDG) are now being made compatible for both FSX and P3D.

-WoAI can be adjusted to work with P3D.

-Most payware sceneries are compatible with P3D. (Fly Tampa, ORBX)

-Vatsim (specifically FSINN) are compatible with P3D.

 

A few questions:

 

So stupid question I know, but if I bought P3D, do I have to purchase the payware scenery or payware aircraft again, or can I use the same purchase details and download the P3D installers from the developer's websites?

 

Does FSINN get installed and used the same way as in FSX?

 

Can I expect a better performance in FPS with P3D compared to FSX with my PC?

 

Add-on products which say they are compatible with P3D v1 and/or v2, does this mean are these products compatible with the latest versions on P3D or not?

 

If I do decide to buy P3D which license do I buy (I am a little confused), the academic or professional?

 

Thanks in advance for any help. It will be greatly appreciated.

 

Best regards

Mark

Part 2:

 

I have done a fair bit of research on P3D but I would like clarification on some main issues that are important to me on FSX:

 

-Most payware aircraft models (PMDG) are now being made compatible for both FSX and P3D.

-WoAI can be adjusted to work with P3D.

-Most payware sceneries are compatible with P3D. (Fly Tampa, ORBX)

-Vatsim (specifically FSINN) are compatible with P3D.

 

A few questions:

 

So stupid question I know, but if I bought P3D, do I have to purchase the payware scenery or payware aircraft again, or can I use the same purchase details and download the P3D installers from the developer's websites?

 

Depends on the developer. Some offer the P3D version for free but a lot of them don't and you have to buy a separate product again (although these seem to be mostly airplanes, like PMDG, A2A, MilViz, RealAir)

 

 

Can I expect a better performance in FPS with P3D compared to FSX with my PC?

 

 

More FPS probably not. You would have to try - P3D has a 60 days refund policy.

Edit: on a second thought, that depends. If some tweak screwed up your FSX now, a freshly installed vanilla P3D or FSX will probably exhibit way better FPS.

 

Add-on products which say they are compatible with P3D v1 and/or v2, does this mean are these products compatible with the latest versions on P3D or not?

 

 

No.

 

If I do decide to buy P3D which license do I buy (I am a little confused), the academic or professional?

 

P3D is marketed as professional software, so everyone is supposed to buy the professional license, no matter what they do with it. Professional software has been around since the dawn of computing and a lot of companies, LM included, found it in their heart to offer a cheaper license for those who cannot afford the professional premium but are nevertheless interesting as future customers - meaning students and schoolkids - hence the name "academic license". Way back when I was a student a simple compiler set you back $1000 - so Borland and the likes offered academic licenses for about 30% of that so one could practise programming at home too. Back then I had to produce a certificate from the university I was at to get the academic license.

Hi All,

 

 

A few questions:

 

So stupid question I know, but if I bought P3D, do I have to purchase the payware scenery or payware aircraft again, or can I use the same purchase details and download the P3D installers from the developer's websites?

 

Does FSINN get installed and used the same way as in FSX?

 

Can I expect a better performance in FPS with P3D compared to FSX with my PC?

 

Add-on products which say they are compatible with P3D v1 and/or v2, does this mean are these products compatible with the latest versions on P3D or not?

 

If I do decide to buy P3D which license do I buy (I am a little confused), the academic or professional?

 

Thanks in advance for any help. It will be greatly appreciated.

 

Best regards

Mark

 

For most, updated installers cover the P3D requirement. For some, you may need to repurchase.

 

No idea on FSINN

 

Yes

 

No, not always. v3.x introduced a complex, different file structure that developers ignore at their - and your - peril.

 

Do your own research. We do not discuss that topic here. If you are confused, then either your research is inadequate, or the product is not for you.

 

Finally, P3D comes with a 60-day refund. So you can try whatever version you qualify for and see if it works.I see nothing in your system specs to suggest you wont get a better, smoother performance than with FSX.

Hi All,

 

Let me begin with acknowledging that there are many threads all over the internet about this very topic and I have done much research about it. I don't really want this turning into a debate as I know its a contentious issue, I would however, appreciate some advice and knowledge on the topic. I have two parts to this thread so bare with me if you have the time.

 

I'll start by providing my system specs:

 

Asus Sabertooth 990FX motherboard

AMD FX9590 4.7 GHz processor (watercooled)

EVGA GTX 980Ti Hybrid (watercooled)

500Gb Samsung evo 850 SSD

16 GB DDR3 RAM

Corsair HX1200i PSU

Windows 7 Home Premium 64x

FSX Delux with Acceleration

 

 

Part 1:

 

I have completed Kosta's tweaks for FSX and used 2 airports (KJFK default and YSSY Fly Tampa) for a small test.

 

At the default KJFK with 100% WoAI traffic my FPS are between 20-35. With 0% traffic my FPS are between 30-40. I am happy with these framerates.

 

However:

 

At FlyTampa Sydney and using ORBX Au scenery, with 100% WoAI Traffic my FPS sit between 10-20. Same airport with 0% traffic my FPS increases to between 15-30. I believe I have a fairly decent high-end PC and I can't help but think I should be getting more FPS. My first question is; while FSX is playable like this, is this the most performance I can expect out of FSX on the system I have?

 

 

These FPS seem to be a little on the low side. Bear in mind that a lot of the tweaking guides are for Intel CPUs. I suggest you start over fresh and go through the tweaks slowly and methodically. If a tweak does not benefit your system, try moving the values to the extremes (like "0" or "9999") just to see what effect it does have - if at all. If it doesn't do anything or even hurts your system, leave it out. With your system I would start by letting FSX rebuild the fsx.cfg, then set up an NVI profile for the 980 as per the instructions on the net. Then you set things in order in the FSX GUI (resolution, AA, filtering, no bloom, cloud draw distance, traffic) first before you proceed to the cfg editing. Next step should be the affinity mask setting and the buffer pools. And so on to the more obscure settings. You could use something like SimStarter that allows you to set and deactivate tweaks via a nice GUI in one place instead of fiddling with files.

 

And make sure that the AI models that you are using are not too heavy on FPS as of themselves. As an example, you could use the PMDG 737 NGX as AI if you wanted to. Just imagine what impact that one would have if there were 20 at your airport.

Thanks nuitkati, I really appreciate your reply.

 

For the AI traffic I'm using WoAI which I don't think are too harsh on framerates. I have tried setting up an MS Flight Simulator X profile with Nvidia inspector with nil noticable difference.

 

I'm a just at a bit of a loss as some youtube videos I've watched on FSX and P3D, the users have similar PC specs to mine with much better FPS. I have tried reinstalling FSX numerous times to start from scratch, which yielded no difference.

 

As to scenery options, a lot of scenery is for P3D v1/2 but there doesn't seem to be a wide range of ORBX for v3 yet. (well at least not the scenery I'm looking at)

 

I would imagine the P3D is similar from a user point of view, as in the way you set up a flight, interactions with FSInn, etc?

Thanks nuitkati, I really appreciate your reply.

 

For the AI traffic I'm using WoAI which I don't think are too harsh on framerates. I have tried setting up an MS Flight Simulator X profile with Nvidia inspector with nil noticable difference.

 

I'm a just at a bit of a loss as some youtube videos I've watched on FSX and P3D, the users have similar PC specs to mine with much better FPS. I have tried reinstalling FSX numerous times to start from scratch, which yielded no difference.

 

As to scenery options, a lot of scenery is for P3D v1/2 but there doesn't seem to be a wide range of ORBX for v3 yet. (well at least not the scenery I'm looking at)

 

I would imagine the P3D is similar from a user point of view, as in the way you set up a flight, interactions with FSInn, etc?

 

Don't expect a miracle "fire and forget" solution. If a vanilla FSX runs badly, P3D probably wont fare any better.

 

Handling: there is not much left of FSX but you will recognize the GUI functions by and large.

 

When using older addons, be prepared (pun intended) to fiddle a lot with config files or migration tools. With the latest version of P3D so much has changed that there is no telling if older addons will work at all. For some tools and addons the original developers aren't even around anymore to update their products.

 

I have migrated some favourite addons to P3D 3.1 and got them to work with a lot of manual effort. But this can really screw things up, the setup is unstable and I get a lot of crashes, mostly due to the fact that the internal workings and external API (SimConnect) changed significantly. There is a lot to be said for sticking with 3.1 compatible addons.

 

One issue that devs are working on is that LM changed the folder structure and config file locations, so at least all installers have to be updated and tested. And devs are supposed to move their stuff outside of the sim proper. The reason is, that more often than not P3D updates are really full reinstalls, and you would lose everything that was integrated too tightly with P3D.

Thanks once again. Sounds like I'm better off sticking with FSX and just being happy with what I have. It just seems crazy that a simulation released 10 years ago is still too intense to use with a decent PC built 2 months ago with decent parts.

Btw, I think you should do a thorough performance analysis of your system. Run some benchmarks, look for bottlenecks. Is the HDD healthy, is RAM working as it should, are your PCIe lanes fully utilized by the GPU, have any AntiVirus or "helper tools" that bog down your system, does FSX utilize all CPU cores, what load is your GPU processing, etc.

I haven't done an analysis as everything is new. I've never done it on past PC's either, I've always looked for software tweaks rather than hardware or software malfunctions. Could you recommend a program to use or a DIY system analysis explanation page?

Thanks once again. Sounds like I'm better off sticking with FSX and just being happy with what I have. It just seems crazy that a simulation released 10 years ago is still too intense to use with a decent PC built 2 months ago with decent parts.

 

Why? Computers were built differently back then and modern PCs did not progress into that direction due to physical limits (clock speed). You can't just go and run software on parallel cores - you would have to completely rewrite the whole thing, and there is no guarantee that you will succeed. Not everything can be calculated in parallel processes, not if the calculations depend on each other. But if set up correctly even FSX will still max out every system, that is in the nature of the sim platform. You can always set things to a higher level.

I haven't done an analysis as everything is new. I've never done it on past PC's either, I've always looked for software tweaks rather than hardware or software malfunctions. Could you recommend a program to use or a DIY system analysis explanation page?

 

"New" does not mean that everything is working like it should. Looks rather like the opposite TBH. Could be that the AMD is just too weak on the ALUs though, but I wouldn't know about that really.

 

As for tools, there are so many out there. Start with Windows built in resource monitor to check if all CPU cores are utilized when FSX runs (affinity mask!). Then use NVI to monitor your GPU in the same way. Run something like crystal disk mark to benchmark your HDD. Go through the list of active Windows services, check if there are things running that shouldn't be. Use process explorer to do the same with active processes.

 

For benchmarking you could try Everest or Sandra, I think one has a few free trials with those.

Thanks heaps for your help.

I've found the worst offender of speed is unneeded processes still running in the background. I agree with Nuikati, use process explorer or even Windows Task Manager to see how much of your process capability is already being used before you even start FSX. I'LL BET YOU WILL BE SHOCKED!

 

If you want better performance ,turn unneeded stuff off! That's the best first step I can recommend.

I use this program and run it before starting P3D. Makes a difference. http://www.bluesprig.com/jetboost.html

I've found the worst offender of speed is unneeded processes still running in the background. I agree with Nuikati, use process explorer or even Windows Task Manager to see how much of your process capability is already being used before you even start FSX. I'LL BET YOU WILL BE SHOCKED!

 

If you want better performance ,turn unneeded stuff off! That's the best first step I can recommend.

Amen