SFB_F-86F_Sabre Fuel Problem?

[rhodges]

Both my aircaft.cfg and fuel selection options in FS9 show fuel provisions and capacities as follow:

Center 1: 90 Gal.
Center 2: 106 Gal.
Center 3: 105 Gal.
Left Main: 67 Gal.
Right Main: 67 Gal.
External 1 (Drop tank): 190 Gal.
External 2 (Drop tank): 188 Gal.

Fuel usage is as follows:
1. Center 2,
2. then Left and Right,
3. then Center tanks in that order.

At this point, I have a flameout for no fuel, although I still have 105 Gal. in the Center 3 tank as well as full drop tanks.

No Drop tanks are shown in the spot view, however, they are listed in the aircraft.cfg fuel section as well as in the filling options of FS9.

I cannot find any fuel management provisions in the panels, nor any reference to it in the manual.

Anyone know what I am overlooking or how to have usage of all of the fuel?

Thanks:
RTH

[napamule2]

I do believe that it would have to be a 'Fuel Selector' switch problem. How many does the cfg list? My 'fix' would be to put the total fuel load (add them up) in Center1, and set positon to '0.0,0.0,0.0' and be done with it, but that's just me. Unless I have a panel that shows fuel loads (per tank) and selectors to go with it, I just mod it to 'work' and go fly!

You could click 'Unlimited Fuel' in the 'Aircraft\Realism' options window-which is really why I came in to post this suggestion-so you can fly (until you fix). 'Real' is really ridiculous on some models with 'old' panels.
CB
Napamule

[rhodges]

Thanks Napamule:

That is just my problem (I think). The 'Fuel Selector' switch does not exist as near as I can tell. I cannot find it in any of the panel window provisions.

The aircraft.cfg reads as follow:
[fuel]
fuel_type = 2
number_of_tank_selectors = 1
electric_pump = 1
manual_pump=1 // FSX only
engine_driven_pump=1 // FSX only

// Longitudinal (feet), Lateral (feet), Vertical (feet), Usable(gallons), Unusable (gallons)
Center1 = 5, 0, 0, 90, 0 // Forward (Lower) Fuselage Tank (95,5)
Center2 = 5, 0, 0, 106, 0 // Forward (Upper) Fuselage Tank (106,0)
Center3 = -4, 0, 0, 105, 0 // Aft Fuselage Tank (106,1)
LeftMain = -5, -5, 0, 67, 0 // Wing Tank Left (68,1)
RightMain = -5, 5, 0, 67, 0 // Wing Tank Right (68,1)

// put in comments, if aircraft is not fitted with drop tanks
External1 = -7, -18, 0, 190, 0 // Drop Tank Left (120,0)
External2 = -7, 18, 0, 188, 0 // Drop Tank Right (120,0)

I will try your "Center 1" suggestion.

Thanks again:
RTH

I do believe that it would have to be a 'Fuel Selector' switch problem. How many does the cfg list? My 'fix' would be to put the total fuel load (add them up) in Center1, and set positon to '0.0,0.0,0.0' and be done with it, but that's just me. Unless I have a panel that shows fuel loads (per tank) and selectors to go with it, I just mod it to 'work' and go fly!

You could click 'Unlimited Fuel' in the 'Aircraft\Realism' options window-which is really why I came in to post this suggestion-so you can fly (until you fix). 'Real' is really ridiculous on some models with 'old' panels.
CB
Napamule

[StringBean]

You could apply Napamule's band-aid, or learn how to operate the plane as designed by reading the included info.

Note #14, the switch is visible, lower-right...


This is a great bird, it's a shame not to enjoy all the work that went into it, especially for the price.

Also...

// put in comments, if aircraft is not fitted with drop tanks
External1 = -7, -18, 0, 190, 0 // Drop Tank Left (120,0)
External2 = -7, 18, 0, 188, 0 // Drop Tank Right (120,0)

...you can eliminate the drop tanks if you wish by adding the comment marks so it looks like...
// put in comments, if aircraft is not fitted with drop tanks
//External1 = -7, -18, 0, 190, 0 // Drop Tank Left (120,0)
//External2 = -7, 18, 0, 188, 0 // Drop Tank Right (120,0)

Makes it more realistic if you are flying a model without drop tanks.

Happy flying!!!

peace,
the Bean

[napamule2]

Bean,
My 'band aid' will work without compromising the aircraft's balance, where commenting out the wing tanks will make your aircraft NOSE HEAVY when tanks are full and TAIL HEAVY when tanks are empty. That's in Flt Sim. Not sure if layout (positon of tanks) are the same on the 'real' aircraft. And if 'ref_datum_position' is not '0.0,0.0,0.0' then you will have another 'can of worms' to deal with.

I've seen it a million times. Either the 'readme' doesn't mention size/weight/balance of aircraft (ie: useful load (which has to include the fuel load)) or wheter the (Fuel) secion has accurate tank position values. They let you hang yourself by merely pointing out the switch position on panel (although not as eleborate as you did) and think that THAT is 'good enough' (ie: describing how it is SUPPOSED to work). Often the values for the 'wing tanks' positions don't even 'match' the model dimensions (ie: location of wings) and if they could be viewed they would be dragging on ground, 5 ft off wing tips, or inside the wheel wells. Ha. So 'work' your switch. But don't expect BALANCE when you do 'play' with it. Ha again.
CB
Napamule

[StringBean]

RTH,

Before commenting out the drop tanks I really think you should read up on the fuel system in the reference material. Double click on f86ef_ref.htm in the aircraft folder and it should open up in your web browser, makes it easier (for me anyway) than reading it in the kneeboard. This is a cool plane.

Chuck,

My post addressed 2 issues raised by RTH, not being able to use fuel from all the tanks, and the aircraft.cfg listing tanks that are not part of the visual model. I believe I successfully addressed both of those issues, though have amended my recommendation re: the drop tanks. At no point in this thread had weight and balance been discussed until you brought it up, Chuck.

So let's talk about it.

Some of us want planes in the sim to perform as close to the real thing as possible.

That means that planes with full fuel tanks will fly differently than they do with near-empty tanks.

Load balance is part of being a pilot.

Your band-aid eliminates the need for the pilot to be concerned about fuel load and tank management by dumping all of it (the fuel) into one big tank in the middle of the plane.

While that approach may work for you, those of us who want it "as real as it gets" might not agree with you.

peace,
the Bean

[rhodges]

Thanks Stringbean.

It has been quite a while since I flew this bird and read the manual completely through. I have to confess that neither this old memory nor eyes are what they used to be. I guess I was looking for something that implied a fuel selection valve and overlooked the notation on the pump.

Concerning learning the procedure, will do!

Thanks again.
RTH

Edit: Works like a champ! What a fine contribution once the user does away with the short between the ears. Thanks guys, and again to the developers of such a fine freeware contribution!

[napamule2]

That's against the law, you know (hehe). I did not CARE if you (or any 'as real as it gets' simmer) AGREED with me. That was not my concern or aim (ie: soliciting for approval). I was only offering a 'temp' solution that would work for the OP without him having to reprogram the sim.

So, when you are climbing into the plane, where do you place your feet (ie: step)? And when you climb into plane, do you ever stand on the seat (and maybe jump up and down to MAYBE prime the landing gear hydraulic shocks, and/or, 'test' the suspension / frame for 'squeaks' ?) I think you just might-but you won't admit it-ha! 'Real' can really get ridiculous sometimes.
CB
Napamule