Computer buying time!

[Piper_Pilot]

Well, it's time to buy a new computer, mainly one that can handle FSX. Now I know I'm not going to get 100% out of FSX with today's technology. However I am hoping to get in the upper 85%. My budget is anywhere from $1,000 to $2,000. So what machines would yall recommend for FSX?

[kingnorris]

Read thru this post, alot of good suggestions:
http://www.flightsim.com/dc/dcboard....id=25490&page=

[Stealth JAG]

Hey Piper,

The $1,000.00 - $2,000.00 price range is going to be a little tricky because FSX is supposed to be optimized for DX10 and DX10 capable video cards are a little pricy (Theres only the 8800 GTX and its over $600.00). However, I think I can give you some advice that might help.

First, if you can wait until February, you might be better off. The ATI version of a DX10 card is supposed to be out then (R600) and it may be better than NVIDIA. It should at least drive the price of DX10 cards down because of competition. VISTA will also be out in January and we will have benchmarks to know whether NVIDIA, ATI, AMD, or Intel products will do better under the VISTA OS. Also, any computer you buy in February will probably be shipped with VISTA so you don't have to upgrade.

Second tip, I would stay away from brick and mortar stores (Best Buy, etc) and the big name computer distributors (Dell, Gateway, HP, the usual suspects). Some companies (like Dell) have a good reputation, but you pay way too much for the hardware you get. I would recommend a boutique system integrator like IBUYPOWER or MAINGEAR. I was able to put together a system with an E6600 Core2 Duo processor, a 7950 GT video card, 2 GB of Ram, and 690i chipset motherboard for about $2,000.00 on the MAINGEAR site.

Third tip, if you really want to buy now, put your highest premium on getting the best processor you can (Like an Intel Core 2 Duo) and then second on the video card (at least 512 MB of video memory). You also want at least 2 GB of system memory, but more than that probably will start giving you diminishing returns. You probably won't be able to get a DX10 card right now within your budget, but you can always upgrade later. Upgrading the processor is always a more expensive and labor intesive proposition.

Just my 2 cents Piper. Let me know if you want me to recommend a specific configuration from a specific manufacture under a specific budget limit for immediate purchase.

Rob

[Piper_Pilot]

>
> Just my 2 cents Piper. Let me know if you want me to
>recommend a specific configuration from a specific manufacture
>under a specific budget limit for immediate purchase.
>
>Rob

Thanks for the above post, and I would love to heard your recommendation for a specific configuration from a specific manufactures under a specific budget limit for immediate purchase.

[McFlysky]

>Well, it's time to buy a new computer, mainly one that can
>handle FSX. Now I know I'm not going to get 100% out of FSX
>with today's technology. However I am hoping to get in the
>upper 85%. My budget is anywhere from $1,000 to $2,000. So
>what machines would yall recommend for FSX?

Keep saving, $2000 is not enough.
Wait until 2007 and see what new products come out.

[Stealth JAG]

OK Piper, here is something maybe you can sink your teeth into. I'll go ahead and reiterate my concurrence with McFlyski (better to wait if you can). But, I've also been on that new car lot, or in that computer store , salivating at the potential joy of a new major purchase. There was nothing going to keep me from walking out of the store of the dealership with my shiny new toy. Sooo - if you have to have the new toy right now (and all guys have been there), here is my recommendation.

The vendor is ABS. I am recommending them because Hard OCP (a sight I trust when it comes to computer information) gave them runner-up on their "Best Overall Value" award. I couldn't get the system price down below 2000.00 on the winner site (Velocity Micro), but I was able to on ABS. You can read about ABS on the link below. That link also gives other good system integrators you can try (like MAINGEAR, etc.)

http://consumer.hardocp.com/article....xoY29uc3VtZXI=

On ABS site (http://www.abs.com), I put together the following rig. I assumed you did not need a new set of 7.1 surround sound speakers, G-15 keyboard, G7 mouse, 24 inch - 2ms monitor, etc. I only configured the box itself. I did do a couple of upgrades to the case (Thermal take Armor case) and the power supply (Enermax 620 Watts) because I think those components are more important than people realize. I set my budget limit at $2000.00 based on your previous post. The Ultimate x9 system I put together for $1962.00 is:

- Thermaltake Armor Aluminum ATX Full-tower Case (Black Color)
- Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition with Service Pack 2
- ENERMAX Liberty ELT620AWT ATX12V 620W Power Supply 90V~265V (Auto
Adjusted)
- Intel BOXD975XBX2KR Socket T (LGA 775) Intel 975X ATX Motherboard
- Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz Conroe FSB 1066MHz 4MB L2 Cache 65nm
- Thermaltake Silent 775 CPU Cooler With Heatpipe Cooling Technology
- CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
- NVIDIA GeForce 7950GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 HDCP KO
Superclocked Video Card (Item#ABS14130066)
- Seagate Barracuda 7200.9 ST3250824AS 250GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache SATA
3.0Gb/s Hard Drive (Item#ABS22148111)
- Seagate Barracuda 7200.9 ST3250824AS 250GB 7200 RPM 8MB Cache SATA
3.0Gb/s Hard Drive (Item#ABS22148111)
- RAID 0 Striped for SATA Hard Drives - Increase Performance
- SONY Black 16X IDE DVD-ROM Drive (Item#ABS27101131)
- SAMSUNG 18 X SuperMulti Dual Layer DVD Burner with LightScribe (Black Color) (Item#ABS27151136)
- Blue 8" x 9" x 6" ABS Mouse Pad (Item#ABS17114110)
- ABS Computer System Binder for Organizing Drivers and Manuals (Item#ABS57101101)

I myself would have gone for the E6700 processor and the 8800 GTS video care for a few hundred dollars more, but I was trying to be disciplined about staying in your budget. I think this will get you about the best frame rates for your money right now. You can always add a DX10 capable video card later.

I challenge any of my fellow computer geeks out there who love FSX to suggest a better system for less than $2,000.00. One note - if you priced these parts out individually at NewEgg, you might be able to build the system cheaper yourself. I just assumed you wanted somebody to build it for you. Hope this helps Piper and good luck.

Rob

[navav2004]

I agree with what the other guys are saying...Wait if you can...If not..I like Jag's parts list...

The only thing that bug's me a bit these days...We need Faster processors...I don't see or hear of them out there right now...It seems there should at least be some scuttlebutt...But I havn't heard anything...

In my view both AMD and Intel's efforts are geared towards adding more cores to processors...I'm really not going to benifit from a 2.8ghz 8 core processor with my FSX...

Waiting a bit may allow the current prices to come down a little?? But...Today's C2D's may be "Our" best bet for a while...At least that's the way I'm seeing it...

I recently built a E6600 system myself...I was kinda planning this to be an intrum FSX system...I thought I'd be building another system in early to mid 2007 and this would become my secondary system...Now...The way I'm seeing it...This may be my Primary FSX system for some time?? I could step it up to a X6800 processor...But I think that may be about it for a while??

Sooo..In a nutshell...What I'm thinking is...Waiting *May* let the prices comedown a little bit...But I'm not convinced your going to find allot more performance out there any time soon...

It will take a little while for DX-10 to settle down IMHO...I wouldn't worry about a DX10 card right now...I got a 8800GTX for the new Rig...But..It Honestly wasn't the "Wisest" move I could have made...

Just *MY* Opinions...

Have Fun...

Chuck

Intel C2D E6600
eVga nForce 680i SLI mb
2GB Corsair PC2-6400C4
eVga 8800GTX
PCP&C Turbo-Cool 1kw
X-Fi xTreme Music
2xRaptor150's (Raid0)
WD Cavier SE16 250gb
Plextor PX760A DVD/RW
Danger Den Liquid Cooling
ASUS Vento Case

[RyanbATC]

Hey Chuck, (not to steal the thread), but what do you think about that?

You said "In my view both AMD and Intel's efforts are geared towards adding more cores to processors...I'm really not going to benifit from a 2.8ghz 8 core processor with my FSX..."

I totally agree. What boggles my mind is how will FSX developers DID NOT utilize mutli core cpus, SLI, etc etc!!!! IMHO, the next CPUs will have more cores, and SLI will be more prevelant. How the heck will MS keep a shelf life if the darn thing doesn't even use dual core/sli etc?????? I mean, technology isn't going the way of faster single-threaded apps....which FSX really is (ok so it benefits a little from dual core but not much)

So I don't see how super duper multi-core CPU's will make FSX better, not to mention SLI. Sure DX10 but I just can't see how that will make all the difference.....GGRRRRRR

[navav2004]

Hey Ryan..Have you been reading about the Aces Team working on a Service Pack(SPI)...And/or a DC Patch?? Maybe everyone will get some relief?? I dunno..

Chuck

Athlon64 FX57
ASUS A8N32-SLI Deluxe
2GB Corsair XMS CL2
XFX 7950GX2 Xtreme
OCZ PowerStream 600w
Raptor 36gb HD
Asus 52x CD/RW
ASUS Vento

[Stealth JAG]

Couldn't agree more with you more Chuck. I don't know what good 8 cores will do FSX until they can figure out how to use more than 2 coers to maximum potential. From what I understand, 2 cores do help a little because background tasks can run on one core while the primary application is running on the other. But I was surprised when I saw that the worlds highest performance processors (Core 2 Duo) were running on clock speeds less than 3 GHz.

I think AMD switching there naming methodology many moons ago may have had more serious consequences than anybody envisioned. It used to be that processor manufacturers marketed their chips by touting raw clock speed power. When AMD beat the performance of intel chips using better architecture (without higher clock speeds), it seemed like they started using other gimmicks to make the processors more efficient (instead of more powerful). It kind of reminds me when the muscle car craze ended. In the early 70's, the Dodge Baracudda was marketed for its 454 cubic inch engine. When the Toyata Celica replaced it, it was marketed with its stingy MPG.

Anyway, I think there is hope on the horizon. There is the ACES patch perhaps. I also think that the heat and power generated by CPUS had to come down because that was a real limiting factor to increasing procesor speed. Now that they have the power consumption and heat down on the chips (with the smaller dye), maybe they can start bumping up the clock speed again. I think they are already even talking about the 45 nm dye chips having higher clock speeds. On the bright side, I have heard of people overclocking their E6700 chips up to 4 GHZ on air cooling alone. I am thinking of trying that myself. That would have been a lot harder without the intellignet design of the Core 2 Duo chips.

BTW Chuck - meant to compliment you on your rig. Can you tell me what frame rates you are getting flying out of a busy airport (like LAX) and what settings you use? I am thinking of building a system like yours and want to know what to expect. Thanks.

Rob