Basic questions about ToM and the repaint template

[davjones]

I'm not sure if these questions should really be here, but the other choice would be the "general discussion" forum, but that's not 727-specific and some of what I'm about to ask is. Hope someone here can help me out -- it sure doesn't have to be Paul or anyone the DF team.

I've done some repaints of AI aircraft and made mods to some other more detailed you-fly aircraft. So I know some of the basics. But now I really want a DF -100 in National delivery colors, and I'd like to take a shot at it myself rather than waiting/hoping for someone else to do it. Now, on to the questions

1) When you open the template files as downloaded in ready-made repaints with DXTBmp, they're "scaled" (drastically shrunk in the horizontal dimenesion) -- presumably because of their huge size. And when I send them from DXTBmp to my photo editor, they're still "scaled". Is there any way to disable this "feature"?

2) The texture files that others have created are downloaded as one large (two including the alpha) bitmap, and then ToM appears to split them up into the various sections needed to reapint the airplane. But the repaint template is a .PSD file. Can ToM convert this into a DXT3 bitmap as well? Is there any reason to work with it in .PSD form at all or is it feasible to just convert the template into a .BMP in the beginning and work with it in that form? The .PSD file is enormous and slow/awkward to work with on my PC.

3) The repaint template is of one airplane, yet (I guess) it is used for FOUR different planes (100 & 200, Pax & freight). I'm confused about how this works. Can anyone explain?

4) Since the template DOES appear to cover all four, is there any simple way to adapt -200 repaints to -100 aircraft? There are three that I'd love to convert to the -100 and one I'd like to convert on the opposite direction.

5) In my past limited experience, I've just edited the individual bitmaps and with patience I've been able to make each section line up with the next and end up looking fine. But working with the repaint template would simplify things in that it's easier to work on the whole airplane at one time. And others have suggested that it makes things easier. Have any of you worked with the individual files (fuse1.bmp, fuse2.bmp...)? How did it work out? I'm wondering if it would be more time effective for me to do it the hard way rather than trying to figure out how to use the template.

I feel a little awkward asking such basic questions but don't know where else to go. If someone is aware of another place where something like this has been dicussed, please tell me. I'd really like to get this National project and hopefully some others "off the ground".

Isn't it great that we have such a terrific airplane to be able to paint and otherwise discuss in these forums? Thanks to all!

...Dave

Dave Jones
Fort McCoy, Florida USA

[ToddNicholson]

I'll try to answer a few

1) Once the file is in your photo editor you simply need to zoom in to a comfortable working zoom factor. You will need to pan the file around to get to the various sections you're working on.

2) If you convert the file to a bitmap before editing it, the image will be flattened and you won't be able to work with the individual layers. You should leave the image as a .psd and work the individual layers. Take a look at the Layers dialog in your photo editor with the file open and you'll see all the many different layers.

3) Yes, one template for all. Again, as above, you'll work with the different layers. I believe they're labeled for each type of aircraft so you know what you're working on. Obviously you won't use the layers that are for a 200, etc, if you're working on a -100.

4) This is possible using layers. It's all about layers :)

5) Working with the single template file is much easier in my opinion. It allows you to work with all the different layers and adjust them to your taste and results in a seamless repaint in the end.

[Paul Golding]

Oh crap!!! Here goes :-)

OK

1) Dxtbmp is not applicable for starters. You need to open the repaint template using a paint program that supports layers.....like Photoshop, Paintshop, Corell?

2) Once you've created your repaint template using the layered psd file, you save the whole image as a 32 bit bitmap and sabve the alpha layer as a 8 bit bitmap with the same name as the main image but followed by _A

When importing the template bitmap into TOM, you choose at that point whether you create 32 bit or dxt3 textures.

3) If open the template using a program that supports layers, you'll find all the layers you need to create 100 and 200 727's as well as pax and freighter versions as well as Super 27 version too.

You just choose what layers to make visible. You might want to look around for a decent repaint tutorial at this point.

4) Not really. You need to add the livery to the psd yourself, though there's no reason you can't add a similar livery template as new layer add use that as a guide what you're creating.

5) You definately don't want to be working with the bitmaps Dave!

OK, that was the answers.

First, get some software that supports layers, I'm sure Paintshop will do fine but it's worth asking on the Screenshot forum what software is suggested for beginners.

Next, have a read of this http://www.flightsim.com/cgi/kds?$=main/howto/paint1.htm

Then, open the repaint template psd and take a look around. I've named all the layers to make it as easy as possible to select the correct ones. Using this is going to be quick compared with manually editing bitmaps. For example, creating lets say, a VIP liveried 727 that's white with a red stripe slightly wider that the windows. Well from opening your repaint software to flying the finished product with all detail lines, rivets, weathering etc, etc, takes in the order of 10 minutes!!!!!

Do the above and please come back for more help as you need it Dave.

[davjones]

Wow! There sure is a lot of good information in those two posts!

I guess the central point that I was not getting was the layered design of the template. I saw various references to the layers in other posts but didn't realize that there were different airplanes hiding under there -- and therefore the fact that DXTBmp doesn't apply to this.

I understand the concept of layers, and don't have any problem in working with them -- I don't think. The problem may be my graphic editing program -- Picture Publisher. I don't think P.P. is very well known, but it's more capable than it's suggests. It doesn't use "layers"; instead it uses "objects", which can then be manipulated with the "object manager". Now an "object" can sit on top of or beneath other objects, and and "object" can be as big as the entire image, so objects are the same things as layers as I see it. The part that worries me is that I don't think P.P. will recognize layers in formats other than it's own native format, i.e. .pp5 files. I can try opening the .psd and see what happens, but I'm not too optimistic.

But I maybe can open the template with Photoshop, then save only the part I need (which is to say the leftmost portion of the layer showing the pax 727-100) and then work with it in P.P., and finally recombine it - somehow - with the full template in Photoshop when I'm finished. Any comments/suggestions on this?

I know -- I could also bite the bullet and attempt to learn Photoshop, but it has always seemed an awkward (though powerful) program to work with. That would require a decision on my part as to how bad I really want the National repaint, as opposed to spending that amount of time actually flying!

Thanks very much for y'alls help! The DF 727 is second to no other add on aircraft I have seen, and the same goes for the DF customer support. Hope I'm explainig this stuff well enough to make sense. I need to spend some time experimenting next. Sorry this post got so long. Thanks again. ...Dave

[Paul Golding]

If picture publisher can handle layers as you think, and if you're doing a repaint that involves painting the fuselage, then you could simply open the psd in photoshop and copy either the 200 or 100 fuselage layer and paste it to picture publisher to work on.

Once your happy with the fuselage, copy it back to photoshop and select/deselect the various layers as required.

You'll also need to edit the alpha layer as well.

The only thing with doing this is that you really need to edit other parts of the template; like add ID markings to the nose gear doors, engine may need colouring and/or contain registration info, the aircraft wingroot, the rear airstair, the tailskid etc.

If you have photoshop, I'd have a crack at using it :-)

[ToddNicholson]

Yes, if you already have Photoshop, I'd recommend using that from the start. It'll same you a lot of time and hassle, especially if you do more than a few repaints. Photoshop can seem very daunting, but for repainting FS aircraft, you barely touch the surface of its capabilities, so the learning curve is not bad at all.

[davjones]

Great! You've both given me plenty to work with. Paul, I did remember the alpha channel but forgot that there are other bits not on the fuselage that I also need to do. It's okay, because if I can manage to get the fuselage done, those other pieces will get done also, one way or another.

Thanks again! ...Dave

[Paul Golding]

Don't forget to show us the finished 727.

[davjones]

Sure, be happy to. But this will take a bit of time. If I'm well satisfied with it I'll also put it up on one or two of the popular flight sim sites. ...Dave

[davjones]

I took a bit of time today to start messing with the repaint template in Photoshop. I see that this template has *many* layers. I also see the value in this layered structure inasmuch as you can set the window layer, and the dirt layer , and the shading layers, etc. right on top of what you paint. WOW! Great time saver! But I'm still having some trouble getting my head around all this. Here are a couple of lingering questions:

1) How does the ~43MB .PSD file that is the repaint template become the roughly ~24MB .BMP that ToM is able to work with? Do you just merge all the layers you want into one and save it as a .BMP?

2) I'll probably need to somehow import bits & pieces from other repaints into the template. To do this, do you add a new layer and then paste the imported pieces onto that new layer?

2) One of the toughest things for this 1965 National color scheme will be doing the bare aluminum -- it goes up to a line right above the windows. This looks like an easy thing to do, but an extremely difficult thing to make it look right. Any suggestions other than trying to import bits & pieces what others have managed to achieve? Or is there a better way?

Seems like this stuff could lead to a powerful headache for the inexperienced, so I'll keep the bottle of aspirin close by. :)

Should be worth the effort to learn it though, I just need a little help getting off the ground. I'd really like to hear any other comments/ suggestions on the subject, even if they're not directly related to my specific questions. Please bear with me -- I know this isn't the place to ask for help with Photoshop itself. All I need is a start and will be okay from there. Thanks again for all your patience and help! ...Dave