Opinions please...

[jumpinjohnny1]

Hello everyone! I just want to take a momment to ask an opinion of fellow flight-simmers.

I am in the Rhode Island area and have been fooling around the past couple of months since I have been laid off of opening up my own business. I figure it's time to do what I want for a change...Enough of that. Here's where YOU come in. I need an idea as to how many people would like the idea of a Flight Simulation oriented store that you would be able to actually visit instead of ordering on-line and through catalogs.

I would carry all flight sim hardware and software packages, from actual simulators to the add-ons that are produced by the many manufacturers as well as books and magazines on the subject. Now, here's the questions:

1. How often during the year do you spend money to buy on flight simulation add-ons?

2. If it was a place that you could actually visit, how far would you folks be willing to travel to be able to go to a store that would specialize in your hobby? (I have several locations in mind all ready. One is off of 146 and 295 in Woonsocket, RI and the other is in North Smithfield off of RT 146, all major highways.

3. Would you be willing to travel to such a place if I opened it?
Internet orders and Mail orders would also be available.

I would like your responses to these questions. I hope the first one isn't too personal to ask, but I need to know to see if there is a good market out there for it. I believe so, and also, last but not least....

4. What products would you like to see carried in the store?

Thanks for your time! I look forward to reading your responses.

HANGAR 18:
Your (soon to be) flight sim-superstore!

[kmbgolf]

I live in mass and would have no problem traveling to R.I for some good stuff.

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thankyou for your opinion....it counts!

[jedster1]

yup, i'm just over the border in dartmouth, ma. i'd come down and check out your place!

fly inverted, the view is better!!.............. jed

[jumpinjohnny1]

Jed...

Thanks for your opinion on this. I'm still working out the details, like business loans, etc....hopefully the bank will be good to me LOL. If you'd like, send me your email address in a private message here and I'll send you an email when and if the store opens. I'm planning on having all the GoFlight stuff carried, other sims, add-ons, etc...it would be like a Toys R Us for flight simmers.

John

[coolian2]

1. Heaps. If i average this year, about twice a month.

2. Not overseas. If i was passing through, hell yeah!

3. Internet and mail.

4. Hmmmm....

[font color= red]Ian Ritchie[/font color= red]
coolian2@hotmail.com

[Edam]

"I need an idea as to how many people would like the idea of a Flight Simulation oriented store that you would be able to actually visit instead of ordering on-line and through catalogs."

"3. Would you be willing to travel to such a place if I opened it?
Internet orders and Mail orders would also be available."

You would get the people fairly local to you coming into the store, probably not enough to make a living, and the others ordering online...maybe.

As for ordering online, would the same products be available elsewhere, and will you have a competitive price for them, or even less than charged by the already established, and trusted, Internet vendors? Have payware developers already shown an interest in your venture, and will make their products available to sell through you?

Being that the walk-in traffic may be low, have you taken into consideration the additional overhead of renting the space, electric bills, advertising, et al?

If you can swing Internet only sales, I would say go with that. I think that you are asking for financial disaster otherwise.

[jumpinjohnny1]

Ian..

Thanks for the response! I sent you an email and you should receive it shortly.

John

[jumpinjohnny1]

Edam...

Thanks for the response...I appreciate all that people have put in. I've done alot of research on this matter, and have contacted the vendors, who have sent me alot of prices. Some unfortunatly actually need a copy of my sales permit and occupancy for the business first, but those will have to wait until it opens up.

As I said, I've done alot of research and this is a UNIQUE store in my area. I think it would fly (No pun intended) and at least family is there too to help out. I was actually talking to someone at a model store that I go to and they actually travel to Mass. from N.Y. to go to the shop to get model cars...

So if you have what people want, they will flock to you.

John

[natman2]

I tend to agree with Edam. I don’t mean to be discouraging but I don’t think you would be able to make it on just FS related software sales. My suggestion would be to find a partner that is interested in offering computer repair. He could handle that end and you could handle the software side offering a verity of software sales but specializing in FS add-ons and equipment. Good luck.

[Edam]

"As I said, I've done alot of research and this is a UNIQUE store in my area. I think it would fly (No pun intended) and at least family is there too to help out. I was actually talking to someone at a model store that I go to and they actually travel to Mass. from N.Y. to go to the shop to get model cars...

So if you have what people want, they will flock to you."

Johnny...

It's the AMOUNT of people who want what you have that matters. Indeed, the problem, in my opinion, is that it's TOO unique for a retail store, if Flight Sim stuff is all that you will have to offer. Plus, basing part of your decision on one person who travels from NY to Mass for models is not a good indication of how your store will do.

In any event, good luck to you, and your family. I hope that you will all take some time to consider what you may be getting into, especially to you, if it doesn't work out and you will have to face repaying your family.

I sincerely hope that you prove me wrong. Keep all of us apprised of your progress.

[jumpinjohnny1]

Natman...

Now that's a good idea too....I had thought of combining installation services as well and set up of equipment. That's a thought to add on to it...

John

[pf_flyer]

I live in Boston and would have no problem traveling to RI. I purchase aircraft and other hardware/software frequently.

Lewis

[rservice]

You might also consider adding other hobby items, such as R/C aircraft, high end aircraft models, even model railroad stuff. I don't know what your expertise is in these areas, but I tend to agree you can't restrict yourself to Flight simulators, it is too small an area of the market to make a living out of. Location and market breadth are keys to developing a succesful business.

[alastairmonk]

Here's a British opinion !!

As with some of the others, I suspect that limiting it to flightsim stuff may be too restricting.

In addition, much of the best add-ons are only available online, with relatively few of them making it to boxed products. So here's a thought - offer online purchasing at the store ! You'd only need a few PCs, and it would have the advantages of you being able to set up links to all the best online sites and be on hand to help with any purchasing problems. The downloaded files could be written to CDR and taken away by the customer.

This would also help the "younger element" who sometimes miss out by not having access to the required credit card. You could set up a purchasing credit card of your own and then take cash/cheque payment in lieu at the store as for any other purchase.

http://www.flightsim.com/dcforum/User_files/3dd8dd565471c1d1.jpg

[Spongey87]

Now there's an idea. Although I am not sure how it would go down with the people you d/l the stuff from. I guess they would be OK with it as long as you pay them.

Better yet would be If you could order per internet the software, and have the CDR shipped to you by mail. Only problem would be the shipping charges, but the good thing is that a CD is not very heavy.

I would love an internet store like that, since I don't have high speed internet and do not live close to New England.


Don't call me weird, call me spongey.

[alastairmonk]

After posting the above it occurred to me that most of the payware downloads are actually free - its the registration that costs money ! Thus the "store owner" could have already downloaded the package, and the new customer would only have to get a copy and provide registration details.

This would have the big advantage of freeing up large amounts of bandwidth. One of the problems all the big suppliers face is that as soon as a new package is released the Servers have to go into Overdrive to try to keep up ! Look at the situation experienced by Lago every time a new Terramesh scenery was released ! No criticism of Lago is implied, but the biggest complaint at each release was that the files couldn't be downloaded as the Server had maxed out. Or that after downloading a 40Mb file, it was found to be corrupt.

I don't see that the original suppliers would mind, as long as they received payment from every customer.

In addition, "suplimentary services" could be offered by the storekeeper. How many DreamFleet 737 pilots would like a full set of quality-printed manuals, properly bound ? With a decent laser printer (monotone or colour) additional copies could be produced pretty cheaply in my opinion. For a modest fee (say $5.00 or so to cover printing costs) customers could take away (a) the product, (b) a full set of liveries (in the case of the DF737 this is over 200) (c) printed manuals etc. etc.
In the case of the UK simmer this could also extend to Yokes and Rudder Pedals - almost totally unavailable here other than by importing from the US.

Clearly all the usual cost-benefit-analyses would have to be observed, but there may be a niche-market for this sort of thing !

http://www.flightsim.com/dcforum/User_files/3dd8dd565471c1d1.jpg

[vfr150]

"In the case of the UK simmer this could also extend to Yokes and Rudder Pedals - almost totally unavailable here other than by importing from the US."

I hear ya there, Alastair........

Craig.

[alanreed]

I live on Cape Cod and would probably drop in a couole of times a year. I like the idea of a partner who does computer repair/troubleshooting. Especially if he were knowledgeable about flight simming.

Alan Reed

[ISPsouth]

vfr150,
I live on Long Island and I would love to take a hop over the Sound to visit. I also know alot of Simers that would probably love to take a trip to RI. as well.
Good Luck

[Top_Gun]

Here's an idea, can you purchase some PC's and have a small LAN there for people to play online? You wouldn't need more than 5-6.

You could set them up to play the sims and use the throttle hardware you plan to sell. Not only is it away to get current simmers to buy product but it might be away to add simmers to the community. The could be a business write off. You could charge people $15per 1/2hr or something like that? You would need another reason to get people into your store and this could help ;)

I know there is a place like this in Boston and a friend of mine has one of these down in Texas.

[jumpinjohnny1]

I appreciate everyone's responses! I am deffinatly going to have to get things rolling with this! Thank you so much for your contributions and ideas! I'll keep you posted on this site with news as far as what is happening. Thanks again!

John

HANGAR 18:
You (hopefully soon to be) Flight-Sim Superstore!

[jumpinjohnny1]

I appreciate the comments. I will deffinatly as stated later in these forums keep all of you appraised of the situation.

John

[jumpinjohnny1]

Lewis...

Thanks for your response. As stated, I'll keep you guys posted. Didn't think I'd get this many answers! LOL

John:-eek

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thanks for your response. As stated, I'll keep you guys posted. Didn't think I'd get this many answers! LOL

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thanks for your response. As stated, I'll keep you guys posted. Didn't think I'd get this many answers! LOL

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thanks for your response. As stated, I'll keep you guys posted. Didn't think I'd get this many answers! LOL

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thanks for your response. As stated, I'll keep you guys posted. Didn't think I'd get this many answers! LOL

[FITZY]

I'm inclined to agree. You would have to have alot of traffic to support a retail outlet. A mall or other high exposure location would also have high overhead. You might need mail order and internet to pay the bills.

The cost of carrying inventory has to be considered, too. If you carried all the good stuff like yokes, etc. you might have to buy in large quantities to get a price that will allow you to be competitive.

To make it go you might have to broaden your offerings to include all kinds of computer games and gaming stuff, maybe even the computers themselves, or real aviation stuff.

I have to admit it would be nice to walk into a place and see all the latest and greatest stuff, hardware and software. I probably would not make a special trip down from NH, though.

A problem too, is that people like to go into a store, ask questions, handle the merchandise then go home and find the best price on the net or in magazines. Camera retailers in particular have a big problem with that.

Just some random thoughts.

[Wolfko]

LAST EDITED ON Dec-19-02 AT 07:08AM (EST)[p]I do not live in your area, but this is how I personally see the general situation/relations between shopping in a "real" store and online shopping.

For me the only things which are important for online shopping are a low price and short shipping/delivery times.
If you open a new and - as I understand - small business, you never will be competitive with the prices offered by the big online stores like amazone.

Regardind shopping in a "real" store, the personal knowledge and and attidude of the sales persons is very important to me. So the know how and the personal advice received by a well educated staff is a big advantage against online shopping.

But, as I see it, the trend is as follows:
You visit a retail store, get all the informations about a certain product, then you go home and check the web, who offers this product for the cheapest price and then you order it online.

Doing it this way, you have learned from the knowledge of a well trained staff and you have bought the product for a cheap price (perhaps the cheapest available).

All this is not fair, but why should somebody spend lots of more money, just because the sales staff in the retail store is so nice and friendly and because the owner has a family, which he has to feed (sarcasm!)?

I know, what I'm talking about, because also the industry I am working in (the travel industry) suffers from this problem.

Wolfgang

[christianholmes]

Hi- A couple thoughts, as I have thought about this EXACT same business for a few years now, and I live in CT. I've worked in retail, but never owned any retail business. I've started a few software development companies.

1) Simply selling retail would not be enough draw. You would definately need something to bring people in- I would build a full-size simulator. Not a multi-million dollar one, but one with some elbow grease. Rig up a Suncom split throttle, and a few monitors, and make it look like a 737 with a good paint job, and nice seats. Run DF737 on it. Offer "Simulator Sundays" where Dads could come in, and get a lesson with their kids on flying the 737.

2) The CDR burning idea is a good one. Don't limit your catalog to what you physically carry- print out pictures of every addon out their in a nice big spiral book that customers cold flip through, so if someone wanted it, you just burn them a CD (with nice label from labelmaker). You could go online and do the transaction for them for a couple bucks. Take screen shots of all the gazillion products out there, and have a screen saver flipping between them on monitors around the store. Catch their eye.

3) Don't put all your eggs in one basket. Vary your merchandise- keep it aviation related, but there's no reason to not sell charts, coffee mugs, flying lesson gift certificates from the local school, scarves, aviator jackets, DVDs, books. What do people buy when they have planes on the brain? Sell it to them. I can't go to an aviation store without buying at least 3 things I never knew I needed. Don't turn it into an Army/Navy store, but more like the Discovery store. Carry a couple really cool products. Like a piccolo R/C helicopter complete kit. Sell it for a good price. Someone will walk in and feel the need to buy it. That's how I got mine.

4) Keep it neat! There is nothing I despise more than walking into a small store and finding it a mess- papers all over, dust on everything. I think this is one of the biggest mistakes of small business owners. This was generally the top prinicple at both retailers I managed at in my college days (Nautica and Software Etc.)

5) Advertise. I know it's a killer up front, but you're dead without it. Be creative about this. Fold your flyers into paper airplanes. I know a great advertising firm that does all kinds of unique marketing material. Support local musuems, and kids events.

I think you could definately turn it into a successful business, but it will take some creative strategies.

[jumpinjohnny1]

Thank you for your response. I'm deffinatly keeping all these suggestions in mind. I'm just getting ready to go to the banks, etc...so I'll let you all know as how I make out.

John

[FITZY]

Check this site out. This is a pilot shop at Nashua Municipal Airport (Boire Field) (KASH). It is where I buy my charts. He has a ton of aviation stuff both for RW pilots and simmers. One can browse for hours just in the book section. If you have time on your hands you might even drive up and check it out. I doubt its a thousand square feet, but he claims to be the biggest or second biggest on the east coast.

Just brainstorming a little here. Sim stuff alone is not enough IMHO.

http://www.wingspilotshop.com/