Problems with exclusions

[pierrot]

I have modified a stock airport with FSXplanner but when I load it as an addon scene in FSX I still have "legacy" FSX stock airport objects showing thru : buildings and taxiway signs.

So I tried to enhance my airport with ADE but I can't figure out WHICH kinf of exclusion polygon I should draw to exclude the offending pieces of stock scenery: I tried almost all options with no succes, the damm signs and buidings are still visible.

Then I went back to FSXplanner to draw a huge exclusion rectangle, but when I load my design into ADE it detects this error:

cruffyDuck Scenery Design Engine Compiling
Using FSX BglComp....
Parsing document: D:\FSX ASW\FS Airport Design Editor\work\loadFrom.xml
INTERNAL COMPILER ERROR: #C2033: XML Parse Error (line, column, error)
ERROR: 14, 0, Text is not allowed in this context according to DTD/Schema.
INTERNAL COMPILER ERROR: #C2033: XML Parse Error (line, column, error)
ERROR: 14, 3, Text is not allowed in this context according to DTD/Schema.
INTERNAL COMPILER ERROR: #C2033: XML Parse Error (line, column, error)
ERROR: 18, 0, Text is not allowed in this context according to DTD/Schema.
INTERNAL COMPILER ERROR: #C2033: XML Parse Error (line, column, error)
ERROR: 18, 2, Text is not allowed in this context according to DTD/Schema.
INTERNAL COMPILER ERROR: #C2606: Schema errors detected, compilation failed!
Parse complete!

What's going on?

Also I see at page 85 of the manual that the stock objects are compiled into the BGL but become editable. The problem is that NONE of these objects display in FSXplanner nor in ADE, they are just visible in FSX!

I'm totally lost! :(

[scruffyduck]

We never recommend working on one airport with multiple utilities. This is because each utility may handle certain things differently.

It looks like you tried to load an xml file into ADE when you got the error. ADE passes all xml through BglComp to make sure that it is valid before loading it.

By the looks of your error message there are some problems in Line 14 and Line 18 of the XML. You would need to find out what these problems are. In fact if ADE cannot load an XML file then you would not be able to compile it in any case so would need to gix these errors first.

To get ADE to let you exclude those stock objects you need to Load Stock Data into your airport. ADE won't do this automatically because you are not starting with a stock airport but one you created elsewhere. You can do this is ADE however by selecting Tools > Load Stock Data. Make sure you are using Version 1.26 of ADE to do this. Once the stock data is loaded the stock items should appear in the ADE display (Make sure you have the Scenery Complexity setting in the menu bar set to Extremeley Dense). Now all you should need to do is delete the buildings etc that you want to get rid of in ADE and compile. They should now be gone in FSX.

BTW for these objects don't draw exclusion polygons since they won't work on library objects, taxisigns or generic buildings

[pierrot]

OK Jon I figured out what was wrong in the FSXplanner-generated XML: a syntax format was not recognized by ADE.

<ExclusionRectangle> ... ... ... </ExclusionRectangle>

was generated instead of

<ExclusionRectangle ... ... .../>

Now the error message is gone and the FSXplanner airport is opened by DAE and can then be compiled into a BGL. And the exclusion seems to work:

In FSX all the inherited misplaced buidings and taxiways signs are gone BUT in the same time:
- my correct taxiways signs are OK
- but all the buidings I had carefully added with FSXplanner do not show.

OK I can start again from the beginning starting with the stock airport, doing everything with ADE but despite the reading of the PDF manual some things are still not clear for me.
For example: "scenery" enhancement elements choice seems poor, the proposed objects are very few. Where could I find a broader choice? How to integrate other libraries within ADE, or make them available to ADE?

Your help is much appreciated. ;)

[jvile]

but all the buidings I had carefully added with FSXplanner do not show.

When you compile the Stock airport the first time ADE will also give you a XML. Open this XML and add back your additional buildings. Save the XML and then open ADE from the XML. Now save again as a .ade and all your buildings will once again be part of the ADE airport.

The sceney list is just an example. In a future version all scenery object GUID's will be available. In the mean time there is a full list that you can download from FSdeveloper which is part of the Whisplacer Utility. The zip from whisplacer is called sceneobjects.zip

[pierrot]

I will have a look, thx ;)

EDIT: Done :(
The XML generated by FSXplanner can't be read by ADE, as I mentionned earlier in this post (a huge number of errors from ADE pov).
Btw. I suppose that I have to place the Scenery objects (in FSXplanner) by their GUID number. The problem is that they display only like the yellow square, not at all at their actual size. Not easy to place many buildings in a cluttered place like an airport.

[pierrot]

I will illustrate the problem with a screenshot and the corresponding airport displayed in ADE (click image to see the full size screenshots).
This is the landscape viewed in FSX...
http://nsa02.casimages.com/img/2008/05/28/mini_0805281113343463041.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=0805281113343463041.jpg)

...and this is the stock airport map displayed in ADE at extremely_dense setting, and having loaded stock data
http://nsa02.casimages.com/img/2008/05/28/mini_0805281117543463069.jpg (http://www.casimages.com/img.php?i=0805281117543463069.jpg)

As you can see, all the objects circled in yellow in FSX are missing in ADE (area circled in purple). On other airports I could see yellow displayed buildings (autogen I think) that I can resize (by a factor) or delete as you suggest. Blue displayed buildings (libobjects I think) can be edited (resized in lenght and width separately) and deleted too.

Here in this scenery the missing buildings are not "seen" by ADE and therefore I can't edit or delete them. And when I attempt to place other objects and move the apron, they are still dispalyed are ruining all my efforts.

Again, I am not trying to edit an airbase previously modified by other software, these are captures of the stock airport.

What should I do, Jon?

[scruffyduck]

This is a problem with ADE and thank you for finding it. To find objects on the airport ADE makes a calculation for each airport to work out a radius around the ARP. Anything inside that radius is added to the airport. In the case of LFSD the ARP is a long way from the area missing buildings and the configuration of the airport means that they are not included. You cannot adjust this in the current version but I will fix it in the next release which should not be too long now. Once again thanks for finding this.

[pierrot]

You're welcome Jon. :p
Since there is no workaround your fixe will be even more welcome.
Along with tons of additional library objetcs directly accessible from the drop menu, and the possibility to add new libraries. Of course. No? Yes! :D

[scruffyduck]

You're welcome Jon. :p
Since there is no workaround your fixe will be even more welcome.
Along with tons of additional library objetcs directly accessible from the drop menu, and the possibility to add new libraries. Of course. No? Yes! :D

Working on the fix and I think you may get most of what you seek in the next version ;)


EDIT

There is a sort of work around that might solve the problem. Change the heading of the main runway to 090 and then run Load Stock Data again from the Tools Menu. Then return the main runway to the correct heading. Do it with a copy just in case things go wrong!

[pierrot]

The funny thing is that I have thought of this kind of trick "all by myself" this morning, having seen that with another airbase some buidings at a distance but in the axis of the main rway are displayed but other ones closer to the AP boundaries don't.
I then thought that maybe the reason could be a rectangular area oriented like the rway, but I may be totally wrong.
Thx for the trick, I can't wait for the next release. ;)

[scruffyduck]

The problem actually relates to an algorithm that calculates the distance from the arp to use depending on runway lengths - for some reason it is not calculating correctly where the runways are more or less N-S so temporarily turning the primary runway E-W and running the load stock process again gives a bigger distance and so the other building should show up. So far not got to the bottom of the algorithm problem but we are getting closer

[scruffyduck]

We have found the problem and fixed it

[pierrot]

Great! :)

Btw, 2 (simple?) additional functions would be of utmost comfort:
- multiple items selection (with Ctrl key and/or by dragging a selection area)allowing less tedious copy/paste operations (eg. trees)
- copy/pasting for polygons also, allowing quick replication of exclusions areas in order to apply different settings for nearly identical zones.

[pierrot]

Yeah, rel. 1.30 is out! Wonderful! ;) :) :p :D

[scruffyduck]

Great! :)

Btw, 2 (simple?) additional functions would be of utmost comfort:
- multiple items selection (with Ctrl key and/or by dragging a selection area)allowing less tedious copy/paste operations (eg. trees)
- copy/pasting for polygons also, allowing quick replication of exclusions areas in order to apply different settings for nearly identical zones.

Some of these are already in the development list :)

[pierrot]

Btw. I just came across your supa-dupa big thumbnails pack. Do you sleep some times?
I didn't even had time to dream of it, you deliver. Astonishing! :D

[scruffyduck]

Btw. I just came across your supa-dupa big thumbnails pack. Do you sleep some times?
I didn't even had time to dream of it, you deliver. Astonishing! :D

Yep I do sleep and do other things as well ;) Hopefully the big thumbnail pack will enhance your use of ADE (or Instant Scenery also of course!)

[pierrot]

I have 2 questions more, Jon:
1 - is it possible, from a large exclusion/flatten polygon, to "cut out a hole" in the middle of it? For instance: from inside a complex AP background polygon, re-open an area in which the autogen could place objects (eg. vegetation, filler objects etc.)? Just to not be obliged to delete the original polygon and re-create it in 2 or many more parts, with the risks not to comply with the original one's outer shape? (one day or another you will be urged to introduce the concept of layers in this beautiful piece of software) ;)
2 - where must the mega-supa-dupa thumbnails library be placed (in APE directories structure)? In other words: how to be sure that ADE actually "sees" all the available objects contained in the pack (there are so many of them that it could be that many dozens of them missing couldn't be easily detected)?
- and 3 (but it's only an extension of question #2): is it possible to add 3rd party libraries (eg.Rwy12 etc) to be accessed the same way by ADE, and where to place them?

You just had nothing to do today except answering my demands, or did you? :D

[scruffyduck]

1 - is it possible, from a large exclusion/flatten polygon, to "cut out a hole" in the middle of it? For instance: from inside a complex AP background polygon, re-open an area in which the autogen could place objects (eg. vegetation, filler objects etc.)? Just to not be obliged to delete the original polygon and re-create it in 2 or many more parts, with the risks not to comply with the original one's outer shape? (one day or another you will be urged to introduce the concept of layers in this beautiful piece of software) ;)

I am not sure how it would work. You can't cut a hole as such I think but you could desing the polygon so that it looked like it has a holde in the middle so I think you would have to make it in one or more parts


2 - where must the mega-supa-dupa thumbnails library be placed (in APE directories structure)? In other words: how to be sure that ADE actually "sees" all the available objects contained in the pack (there are so many of them that it could be that many dozens of them missing couldn't be easily detected)?

Anywhere you like. Then just go to Tools > Library Object Manager and select the thumbnail folder:

http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn269/scruffyphotos/ScreenHunter_164A.jpg

After that ADE will find all the thumbnails


and 3 (but it's only an extension of question #2): is it possible to add 3rd party libraries (eg.Rwy12 etc) to be accessed the same way by ADE, and where to place them?

You can do that now. Look in the dialog above (The library object manager) Select the Tools menu and then Add Objects Select the library you want to tell ADE about and it the information will be loaded. Of course you will need to have the original library bgl and textures located in an activated scenery area in FSX for them to show up. ADE does not store library objects themselves but references to them

[pierrot]

You can do that now. Look in the dialog above (The library object manager) Select the Tools menu and then Add Objects Select the library you want to tell ADE about and it the information will be loaded. Of course you will need to have the original library bgl and textures located in an activated scenery area in FSX for them to show up. ADE does not store library objects themselves but references to them
OK.I am not sure how to do that since Rwy12 depicts objects in XML file collections. Should I first compile them into BGLs? And how? :confused:

Of course I understand that ADE doesn't actually place the objects but only pointers.

[scruffyduck]

OK.I am not sure how to do that since Rwy12 depicts objects in XML file collections. Should I first compile them into BGLs? And how? :confused:

Of course I understand that ADE doesn't actually place the objects but only pointers.

Ah - OK - ADE does not read the Rwy12 xml files but it reads the bgl files. Rwy12 xml files are just references to library objects stored in a bgl file. To add object information to ADE you need to load the data from the bgl file