AVG 8 --not free? No 98/se/me?

[angels355]

I updated AVG 7.5 and got a notice in the lower left corner of the AVG window that said an update was available to AVG 8. So today I look it up, and it's payware? 30 day trial, something about losing some features after 30 days?

Anyone know what this means? No freeware AVG 8?

This intro article below about AVG 8 says that it runs on all Windows 32 and 64 bit OS's, so what about 98/se/me? On the download.com website, they say that AVG 8 only works on NT 5 and 6, win2000, xp, and vista. No more 98/se/me?

I hope that AVG 7.5 is supported for a while to come.


http://www.grisoft.com/ww.90627

[xxmikexx]

angels355,

I can't confirm your speculations about AVG OS support. I hope someone will come along and explain the facts of the situation. However, it would not surprise me in the slightest your speculations turned out to be true, for the following reasons ...

Windows 95, 98, 98SE and ME are all DOS-based, in effect. (So were Windows 2.x and 3.x)

In contrast, Windows NT 3<.41?>, NT 4.0, Windows 2000, XP and Vista are all based on ... ... The VMS operating system for the DEC VAX!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I know this because the architect of VMS, Dave Cutler, was the architect of NT, and while I was at DEC he and I were drinking buddies. Here's what went down ...

VMS had undergone a natural and relatively quick evolution from V1 through V4. V5 was to have been an important set of extensions to VMS, but DEC management killed the project shortly after release planning was complete.

When that decision was taken, Cutler immediately called Microsoft and then put himself on the next airplane for Seattle. The following day he met with Gates and his technical management team and explained his (Cutler's) vision for VMS V5 and beyond in an extremely long meeting that ran well over the allotted time. Gates was so impressed that he offered Cutler a job on the spot, and Cutler accepted on the spot.

Now ... The OS series was to be called "Windows New Technology" -- WNT for short. But in the immortal words of the light night TV announcer, Wait, there's more !!!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Not only did I know Cutler, I was also friends with Rich Lary, a DEC corporate resource wunderkind. Several years after I left DEC, Richie, my former white water rafting partner, told me the following story ...

He had called Cutler just to shoot the breeze for old time's sake. At one point in the conversation Richie mentioned to Cutler that he, Richie, had noticed something interesting. If you take the letters VMS and "add one" to each of them you get V->W, M->N and S->T. In other words, VMS->WNT.

"Of course" Cutler said. "What took you so long?" :)

[angels355]

Mike,

Fascinating.

Is Cutler the person they refer to when they say that the designer of NT4 is working on the secretive Windows "Cloud" OS? Next after Vista is going to be Windows "Seven", I think they are referring to NT7, simple. But there's another OS being worked on called "Cloud", and the NT designer is supposed to be working on it.

[xxmikexx]

angels355,

I expect that it is in fact Dave Cutler because the Cutler I knew will die with his system design boots on. He's about my age now, 64 or so, but that would not stop him, nor would Microsoft want it stop him. VMS and its successors is his life's work, and it has been so since roughly 1976.

While we were at DEC together I had many disagreements with Cutler about various system design issues but that's normal. The fact is that Cutler is an operating system genius, and I would not presume to put myself in his class.

But I can't be sure about "Cloud". I haven't spoken with Cutler since I left DEC in 1981, and I haven't spoken with Richie in about five years, so I really don't know what's going on today.

[Kimber]

I looked at the AVG site, and nothing has changed, I think you just
got an ad from them!! We get one now and then!!

For single computer home use, it is still free!!

Only the virus thing is free!!

[loki]

The free version is version 7.5 though, not the new version 8. I too wonder what they will do as most companies won't maintain older version for very long after a new one comes out.

[jwenting]

Well, Windows ME and older are legacy systems that are no longer actively supported by Microsoft, nor by pretty much anyone else. They're a decade old for crying out loud.

Use at your own risk, you should have known this day was coming for quite some time.

[angels355]

angels355,

I expect that it is in fact Dave Cutler because the Cutler I knew will die with his system design boots on. He's about my age now, 64 or so, but that would not stop him, nor would Microsoft want it stop him. VMS and its successors is his life's work, and it has been so since roughly 1976.

While we were at DEC together I had many disagreements with Cutler about various system design issues but that's normal. The fact is that Cutler is an operating system genius, and I would not presume to put myself in his class.

But I can't be sure about "Cloud". I haven't spoken with Cutler since I left DEC in 1981, and I haven't spoken with Richie in about five years, so I really don't know what's going on today.

That's very exciting. You should try to give Mr. Cutler a call to ask how he's doing! If he should force upon you an outlandishly high paying exec job....then hire me too!! I have an endless list of sports cars and aircraft that I'm just dying to buy! And only want to stimulate the economy single handedly! With my ambitious spending ideas, I could probably get the President's Meritorious Medal of Shopping!

[angels355]

The free version is version 7.5 though, not the new version 8. I too wonder what they will do as most companies won't maintain older version for very long after a new one comes out.

That's what I'm worried about. I still use Ad-Aware SE for 98/se/me, and I have to manually download the updated definitions. Also I'm stuck with an old version of Zone Alarm. I now have three routers, but they don't accommodate dialup for their hardware firewall feature if applicable, etc.

I'm writing a letter on my celeron d computer, a couple months ago that 2.53 ghz celeron d was stripped and tagged for the junk heap. I rescued it (and cleaned it OMG!), friend sent me some DDR ram, plugged it in and I was good to go. Installed all the missing components w/ parts on hand (including blank hdd, it had no hdd either, and the hdd is still blank), dropped the ubuntu 7.10 disk into the cdrom drive, dropped Mo'z Great Mass in C minor in the cdrw drive, started up openoffice, used the printer wizard to install my psc 500 (I have the 95 driver disk for 98/se/me, but guess what no download whatsoever for 98/se/me drivers from hp, of course you already know that but just in case others are not aware of it). So, printer functioning nicely, Mo playing, and I'm typing away. Speakers were a gift also, yesterday. Absolutely everything was either free or extremely low cost, including free Ubuntu and openoffice plus gimp and chess on the live disk. The Mo cost me about $17 however.

It's extremely nice to have alternatives, especially when Ubuntu has a promise that it will always be free! Ubuntu 7.10 is the best I've tried so far at the live disk level (haven't downloaded any of the 4.6 gb versions). What is the new distro you're using? And what is your favorite so far? A friend of mine swears by the Kubuntu 7.10 4.6 gb install. I've tried out Sabayon, it's nice, much like Kubuntu, but with only the live disk to judge I like Ubuntu 7.10 best so far. Knoppix was a very nice surprise! I like it also, but 2nd to Ubuntu.

I guess I can use AVG 7.5 for a while, possibly check into Avast again, they are much better than I had thought before, but not sure if they support 98/se/me still. My neighbor is a computer professional, not sure what doing, but before they move to their new house on the island I might ask him if he could help me to set up the dialup for Ubuntu.

I have 3 linux antivirus programs, and OH YEAH! I just remembered! One of my live disks, can't remember which one, maybe one of the U/Kubuntus has an opensource antivirus program for windows! I can double or triple up with that plus avast maybe.

I try to have my data backed up very frequently, and so am nearly always ready to zero fill and start over.

[angels355]

I looked at the AVG site, and nothing has changed, I think you just
got an ad from them!! We get one now and then!!

For single computer home use, it is still free!!

Only the virus thing is free!!

Thanks Kimber,

I appreciate it. I wonder if the avg version 8 is free to try for 30 days with all the bells and whistles included, then after 30 days the extra features drop off but the antivirus protection is still free?? I hate experimenting with such a thing. What do you guys/gal think?

OH! I forgot! It only runs on NT5 and 6!

[jwenting]

Just buy a good AV product like Kaspersky...

[loki]

That won't work for those running anything prior to Windows 2000, like angels355...

[angels355]

Well, Windows ME and older are legacy systems that are no longer actively supported by Microsoft, nor by pretty much anyone else. They're a decade old for crying out loud.

Use at your own risk, you should have known this day was coming for quite some time.

I'm a little blase about 98, but I still like 98se/me. Despite their age, they are incredibly useful, and they run on old hardware, which is what I have, and most importantly, they run my flight sims from fs9 and earlier versions. Technically xp would run on most of my hardware, however it would be perhaps 30 to 50% as fast as 98se/me in some cases. Some would run xp OK to good.

A couple days ago I had the chance to purchase a used unit of XP Home, the retail upgrade version for $35. I passed it up, I hate upgrade versions, and xp pro would be nicer. Does the retail home version have unlimited activations? I'm only familiar with xp pro.

Right before the previous recession I was the victim of many crimes, including violent ones, and financial ones also, the authorities however ignored my long winded complaints. That's just the way scientists are treated these days. So instead of a Ferrari, Mac Pro, and big gaming computer, I've had to live very frugally while taking care of my Mom after several deaths in the family. The upside is that I have completely transformed into an amateur computer technician, before I was pc ill'i'er'itt.

Like you also most likely, I have hopes of recovering, and getting back on my feet. My Ferrari hat needs replacing. After a great deal of study on the internet, these forums, and flight simulator, I may not try to get a Learjet in the future if I succeed again. They have hardwings, no leading edge slats or leading edge flaps, which makes them very risky to fly due to their bad stall characteristics. The Learjets on flight simulator, while FUN to fly, are not anything like the real thing regarding stalls. Learjet stalls are dangerous. Possibly a Gulfstream III might have leading edge slats. What's the use of living if you can't dream big, and I always dream big!

[barty]

Well, Windows ME and older are legacy systems that are no longer actively supported by Microsoft, nor by pretty much anyone else. They're a decade old for crying out loud.

Use at your own risk, you should have known this day was coming for quite some time.

Aww...we don't need to pound on the troglodytes (sorry, I just like that word) that still think Win98SE is the best OS since sliced bread.

For anything "old" that I have, I just toss Linux or Win 2000 on it if it doesn't play well with XP because of a lack of memory or CPU power. Outside of manufacturing environments where you may come across old ISA boards running equipment that was made for that specific purpose, (lord help you if it breaks...been there, done that, saw a running copy of Win 3.1 for the first time in almost a decade) there's not much out there that hasn't been replaced by newer hardware that can be had on the cheap. I used to be able to grab older PCs and laptops all the time (mainly high end P3s, stuff that was first class when XP first came out) and I couldn't hardly give the PCs away.

XP Home = XP Pro minus the ability to join the PC on a domain and you can't access the admin account in anything but safe mode. And you probably can't install IIS on Home either. None of these are real limitations to about 90% of the general public, the other 10%, myself included, just don't like having to fool with some of the quirks you'll come across. Upgrade disks are no biggy. My first copy of 2000 was an upgrade, I just had to have a 95/98 disk handy during the install routine so it could verify that you had a previous OS. Takes an extra 15 seconds to do this, mainly from waiting for the CD to spin up. With that in mind, I don't think Home was ever released as a VLK (volume license key) version. It was either OEM or retail, which does have a limit on how many activations you can do.

If you're running 32-bit apps, 2000/XP is probably the fastest environment for doing so. 98 still has a 16-bit DOS shell that it runs on, and doesn't run 32-bit apps natively. So just chuck it into the stack of computer history and move on.

On a similar vein, at a hamfest this weekend, it was pretty funny watching these guys trying to sell a bunch of old, outdated hardware and software for like new prices. I just didn't have it in me to tell them that they're half out of their minds on those prices....

[jwenting]

There are more restrictions to XP Home (and the Vista Home editions) than meet the eye.

Try to install Oracle (not the XE version) on a Home edition for example. Won't work, says it's missing something required.
OK, most people won't do that, won't even know what it is, but it's an indication that there's something in the Pro versions that's not in the Home editions beyhond the extended networking support.

[angels355]

Aww...we don't need to pound on the troglodytes (sorry, I just like that word) that still think Win98SE is the best OS since sliced bread.

For anything "old" that I have, I just toss Linux or Win 2000 on it if it doesn't play well with XP because of a lack of memory or CPU power. Outside of manufacturing environments where you may come across old ISA boards running equipment that was made for that specific purpose, (lord help you if it breaks...been there, done that, saw a running copy of Win 3.1 for the first time in almost a decade) there's not much out there that hasn't been replaced by newer hardware that can be had on the cheap. I used to be able to grab older PCs and laptops all the time (mainly high end P3s, stuff that was first class when XP first came out) and I couldn't hardly give the PCs away.

XP Home = XP Pro minus the ability to join the PC on a domain and you can't access the admin account in anything but safe mode. And you probably can't install IIS on Home either. None of these are real limitations to about 90% of the general public, the other 10%, myself included, just don't like having to fool with some of the quirks you'll come across. Upgrade disks are no biggy. My first copy of 2000 was an upgrade, I just had to have a 95/98 disk handy during the install routine so it could verify that you had a previous OS. Takes an extra 15 seconds to do this, mainly from waiting for the CD to spin up. With that in mind, I don't think Home was ever released as a VLK (volume license key) version. It was either OEM or retail, which does have a limit on how many activations you can do.

If you're running 32-bit apps, 2000/XP is probably the fastest environment for doing so. 98 still has a 16-bit DOS shell that it runs on, and doesn't run 32-bit apps natively. So just chuck it into the stack of computer history and move on.

On a similar vein, at a hamfest this weekend, it was pretty funny watching these guys trying to sell a bunch of old, outdated hardware and software for like new prices. I just didn't have it in me to tell them that they're half out of their minds on those prices....

Troglodyte! Ya that's me! Cave dweller, but it was the STRAOS DWELLERS who put me down here to dig for their zienite! And to run 98se/me! The dust really gums up the equipment! Wish I had those @#@%* masks!

It's funny that those people were trying to sell pIII equipment at high prices, I pull mine out of dumpsters (w/ permission and pre-erased hdd's), and am given them for free needing repairs which I do, most I've paid is $20 for my favorite pIII and first fs9 computer. I have several 1.4 to 2.5 ghz amd, and celeron projects, trying to install me on a 2.53 ghz celeron right now (had to start over due to dead hdd). Before the last recession (and having been a victim of several crimes then), I intended to strictly only have high end Mac pro's. But then having some hardships put upon me put that idea on hold indefinitely, while I studied a little super computing incidentally with advanced physics, I learned to appreciate old hardware. Now I think it's kinda fun, although my primary internet computer seems to be fizzling out possibly, using my 2ndary right now, 300 mhz of blazing speed. Really, for doing the internet, there's very little difference between it and the 2.53 ghz celeron d that's next to it.

Thanks for the info on how 16 bit 98se doesn't run 32 bit applications natively, that's very interesting. I did have once xp pro on a 333 mhz pII which was really lame as it only had a 66 mhz frontside bus which makes a difference down at that level. For example a bigger video card made no difference, and the ram was already maxed at 256 mb's. Any way, xp pro on that was really slow, it was functional, unlike linux, but slow. XP has very nice properties, but for old equipment like that it needs either 98se or me to run very well. I haven't found a linux solution yet for computers below perhaps 933 mhz. I think I did try it out on a 700 mhz computer that's basically maxed in upgrades for it's level, and I think I got some basic functionality but it didn't like it. I have to do more research in that area, maybe either older versions, or distros make for older hardware. Ubuntu 7.10 runs well on both my celeron 2.53 ghz and 933 mhz pIII, but Kubuntu 7.10 only runs on my 933 mhz pIII, the 2.53 ghz cel d will only run Kubuntu 7.04.

Any way, I gear a flight sim for each of the more powerfully built computers of these past eras, and for flight simming they work great, from fly!2K, fly!II, fs98 through fs9. I actually do have a couple of laptops running win 3.1 but don't like it at all.

I use the old equipment because I get work and function out of them at a very low cost, and collect newer or better hardware when I can. It's been difficult trying to get back on my feet, but I've kept on trying. Back then the authorities ignored my complaints about those crimes, and one low level judge even sided with the people who committed crimes and lied right to her face in court. So I try to be very careful who I work for now. I've had one employer after another like that.