View Full Version : 727-200?
12-21-2001, 11:58 AM
I see you are going to do a 727! THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!! I cannot wait! If it is HALF as good as your 737, I will die from delight!! But please, stay true to the panel, keep evrything where it is and make them separate windows. I hate it when things are moved to other panels for the sake of brevity or ease of use. I want total REALISM! I am a 727 NUT, and know the panel inside and out.
Will it be a -200? Advanced? Hush-kitted? PLEASE include the Text-O-Matic and give us the cargo operator's liveries (FedEx, etc.)so we can be as realistic as humanly possible ( you know hardly anyone uses the 27 for scheduled service anymore). Please, whateverinformation you can give , do!
12-21-2001, 12:14 PM
Hardly anyone uses the 727?
Only the four largest airlines in the world.... United, American, Delta and Northwest, plus FedEx and UPS all still fly the "pig" (as I heard a NWA pilot call it).
12-21-2001, 12:18 PM
I hate flying on them (Delta's). We blew the number 3 engine before V1 on takeoff from Ohare two weeks ago. Caused a 4 hour delay after already being an hour late due to electrical problems.
What a piece of junk. The interior sucks, everything was worn out and dirty. 727s are the Chevy Novas of the sky.
The 767 is the best ship for traveling from a traveler's perspective.
Maybe, but this is from a flight simmers perspective. The 727 may not be your favourite, but it sure should be entertaining to fly from a PC.
12-21-2001, 12:37 PM
I think I'll enjoy flying the 727 in flightsim, a nice old rough aircraft, but its buses all the way for quality, reliability and safety. IMHO
12-21-2001, 06:40 PM
United retired theirs last month... My dad flew em for about 8 or 9 years in all 3 crew positions and it's his favorite plane... I agree with you though, I enjoy flying on 757s, 767s and 777s the most!
12-22-2001, 01:14 AM
I read in Aviation Week that most are being phased out even sooner than expected due to the downturn post 9/11. That is why I say most don't ( or won't be soon).
12-22-2001, 09:48 AM
>I hate flying on them (Delta's).
> We blew the number
>3 engine before V1 on
>takeoff from Ohare two weeks
>ago. Caused a 4
>hour delay after already being
>an hour late due to
>What a piece of junk.
>The interior sucks, everything was
>worn out and dirty.
>727s are the Chevy Novas
>of the sky.
>The 767 is the best ship
>for traveling from a traveler's
First you are talking about an aircraft that is 30 year old it was great in it's time and they are still great birds.
If you ask a 727 driver who frequents the ##### forums I am sure he will tell you he really enjoyed the 72's.
I beg to differ the 777 is THE best ship for traveling from a traveler's perspective. A study was done over the summer months and the 777 won those honors for the 5th strait year.
John Thomas and Family
12-22-2001, 04:02 PM
Boy Oh Boy....
How you describe that 30+ year old plane is the exact same way I feel when I see your continual negative, miserable and self-serving posts here and on other forums...
Get a life dude...
I cant help but think that you must really need attention and so you in selfish way attempt to get it in forums like this..
Find something postive for growth and betterment in your life.. then you will gain some self esteem... and find it worthwhile to live and gain the respect of others...
12-22-2001, 04:06 PM
Like I have asked this in a previous post:
Is there a chance that we will see a Super27? With -217C or -219 engines on the pods and with winglets? Maybe even an updated cockpit version, like FedEx's flat panel EADI & EHSI, as well as the old clockwork cockpits?
Whatever you have in store for us; I am looking forward to see the new 727 !!! Thank you Dreamfleet!
12-22-2001, 05:50 PM
I find your continually negative posts the same as you feel about the 727 you have spoken of...
In every forum I have seen you post in it is always the same: bashing, confrontational, negative, sometimes hurtful and personal.
Yeah you have the right to express yourself in any manner you choose, American law allows this... but intelligence and esteem can not be legislated ! you make this blatantly true...
Who amongst us thinks that a 30+ year old, tired, at the end of its life 727, represents what was once the zenith of airliner design?
Besides, What does the condition of the engine, passenger seats and cabin have to do with sim aircraft anyhow?
I am sure the flight dynamics were unaffected by age? Isnt this what we hope to have simulated?
Not 4 hours of delayed time in a terminal. (computer crashes, lock-ups already simulate this part !)
Myself, I would've used this free time to be watching all the planes landing and taking off... enjoying my time there...
Another way to look at this old plane: she has successfully carried many, many hundreds of thousands of people, (most likely millions) to many places. She has lived up to her owner/s goals, she hasnt hurt any paying customers, she has been profitable, reliable, comfortable, quiet, safe, fast.
She paved the way for what have today. The 727 brought Jet service to many airports that had never had jet service. Her shortfield performance is actually quite good. She enabled airlines to service locations that didnt have ground facilities or aircraft service, she was fully self contained, with her own stairs and ground power. She could land on gravel, unimproved runways
She was still there, that day you saw her, to again be loaded and do what she has done so well for over 30 years... She has indeed been most successful, she still is one of the most popular and prolific airliners ever built.
She has already done what others dream of for the Airbuses and Boeings of today...
I am among the many sim pilots who have said we cant wait to see a 707 and 727...
Personally I think the 727 was and still is one of the most beautiful airliners ever built... no matter what shape its in... I can still see her beauty and designers' dreams fly strong and high...
12-23-2001, 02:59 PM
Thanks for the amateur shinkwork. You're a judgemental person. I am not always negative, my posts are almost always positive and I ask a lot of questions.
I guess a hippy like you needs sunshine blown up his rear end. Just in case you haven't noticed, your reply to me was quite judgemental and negative. Since you're an expert in what my posts have said, why don't you go back and take another recount.
The 727 is a pig according to a NWA pilot I met and I've had nothing but terrible travel experiences on them in the last 5 years. Delta doesn't keep them in good shape. Needless to say, I would like to fly them in FS2002, though. Passenger-wise, I don't want to be on them.
12-23-2001, 03:04 PM
>Like I have asked this in
>a previous post:
>Is there a chance that we
>will see a Super27?
> With -217C or -219
>engines on the pods and
>with winglets? Maybe even an
>updated cockpit version, like FedEx's
>flat panel EADI & EHSI,
>as well as the old
>Whatever you have in store for
>us; I am looking forward
>to see the new 727
>!!! Thank you Dreamfleet!
I believe Lou posted some time ago that the 727 will feature the old stuff, no glass cockpit upgrade, no FMC. The way flying used to be. Not sure if they will have a HK version of the 3 holer or not.
But for those who like to fly the old iron the 727 will be a welcome site :)
John Thomas and Family
12-23-2001, 03:06 PM
LAST EDITED ON Dec-23-01 AT 03:08PM (EDT)[p]If you live in England and have read the papers over the summer you would know that the 777 has had many problems with its air conditioning systems and autopilot. Making crew and passangers alike ill! All were eventual recalled and 'fixed.' I also believe for comfort the Airbus wins hands-down in surveys.
Bring on the 727, make it rustic :-)
01-04-2002, 08:54 AM
AS a former real 727 pilot I can clearly see you are not a real pilot because you do not know what are you talking about YOu only have a reference from just one nwa pilot but you have never flown a 727 as a pilot only as passenger so keep your passenger perspective and keep calling her a pig but you will be very sorry that you never will be able to fly a nice plane like the beatiful and safest 727 look at stadistics they do not lie.
Do not bother to answer I am not interesting in ignorant points of view
01-04-2002, 08:52 PM
Real interested in getting in the last word, huh? I will reply, but I'm not interested in your reply Maurice. How's that?
Note my last line. Read my friggin post before you post. I said I would like to fly one in FS2002, but my travel experiences in real life have been very bad on the seven two in the last 5 years. Maybe Delta just doesn't maintain them well?
But you're right. Being held up in Chicago for 5 hours because I'm on an antiquated plane is really fun. Sure, nothing to complain about there. You would've been smiling because you're on a 727.
It has nothing to do with the fact that the old girls aren't reliable like they once were. I stick to my guns - the 727s were nice in their day, but they need to be replaced. Couldn't tell you the last time I was delayed due to equip failure on an Airbus or late model Boeing.
You know, an old car isn't nice anymore if it's all worn out and breaks down all the time. Same thing with planes.
Don't you like the 777? A marvel of technology.
01-04-2002, 09:28 PM
LAST EDITED ON Jan-04-02 AT 09:29PM (EDT)[p]WOW ... all I can say is that I spent what seemed to be years in the wonderful "old" 727. Very fond memories of it being a comfortable aircraft. I used to travel all over the east coast 20+ years ago .. and the boston - LaGuardia shuttles .. Delta, New York Air (remember that one?) and Eastern all used the 727 ... I used to do that at least once a week ...
Anyone remember a "compressor stall"? on certain windy days, when a 727 turned into a cross wind and started the take off roll, the middle powerplant would sometimes not get enough air ... and stall ... a BIG LOUD POP .. not quite an Explosion.. although i think it might have been a "pants changing experience" for some .. pretty scary :-) (Just like being out of doors on a cold windy day turning perpendicular to the wind sometimes "takes your breath away". Many compressor stalls in Boston and Philadelphia ... they would turn off the runway to a "run-up" area ... restart the engine, spool it up and down a few times, tell the passengers what happened and we'd be on our way. Great stories for my kids then ... great memories now!
I used to try for the last row so I could hear the engines ... what a nut huh? also used to smoke in the last 10 rows or so.
So .. Lou is going to make me an honest person learning to manually fly the 727 ... o boy!!!! Challenges ... Please Lou maybe a little hidden switch to let a poor old man like me use the GPS and Autopilot ... hehehehe ...
01-04-2002, 09:29 PM
LAST EDITED ON Jan-04-02 AT 09:30PM (EDT)[p]Indeed, no FMC, no LNAV, no VNAV, no autoland, and only those who know how to really fly (either virtually or for real) need "apply" for the 727.
No, it will not be as popular as the "robo jets", but then again the 727 will quickly separate the "pilots" from the "programmers". ;-)
:-lol Just imagine, no AFDS to fly the sids and stars for you!
We're very much looking forward to doing it, and later the 707. They're both right up this pilot's alley. :-)
The 727 a "dog"? A "pig", I don't think so, not by a long shot! ;-)
Yeah, maybe we'll stick in a hidden NAV/GPS switch! :-eek
01-04-2002, 10:05 PM
You gotta love the 707 and the 727!! The best aircraft Boeing ever made along with the 737-200!
01-04-2002, 11:27 PM
>LAST EDITED ON Jan-04-02
>AT 09:30 PM (EDT)
>Indeed, no FMC, no LNAV, no
>VNAV, no autoland, and only
>those who know how to
>really fly (either virtually or
>for real) need "apply" for
>No, it will not be as
>popular as the "robo jets",
>but then again the 727
>will quickly separate the "pilots"
>from the "programmers". ;-)
>:-lol Just imagine, no AFDS to
>fly the sids and stars
>We're very much looking forward to
>doing it, and later the
>707. They're both right
>up this pilot's alley. :-)
>The 727 a "dog"? A "pig",
>I don't think so, not
>by a long shot! ;-)
>Yeah, maybe we'll stick in a
>hidden NAV/GPS switch! :-eek
Sweet Music to my ears, See this is what I am talking about real flying :)
Lou hope you are going to try to bring Dave on for this project :)
01-05-2002, 12:32 AM
That exact thing happened to me a couple years ago (compressor stall). Didn't know it was a common event. I thought we beat the odds and hit the crosswind just right. I told everyone it was a long shot that it happened to me. Nice to know that it happened all the time on the No. 2 engine.
It sure is a loud bang. Sounded like a cannonball hit the side of the jet! Scared the shi-ite out of everyone.
We idled down, pulled off and took er back to the gate for an engine check. I took another flight home on a seven five.
01-05-2002, 11:00 AM
Dave is on for the project, and thank goodness, as their ships did not have the FMC (actually it would have been a "GFMS" I believe). That was the deciding factor not to have any of that stuff in it, as the vast majority of 727s do not.
We will also have another well known airline pilot consulting on it also. ;-)
Made me a very happy pilot! :-)
01-05-2002, 12:40 PM
Hehe, flying a SID on the NAV Radio's is fun, and just for practice I usually do it 1 in every 3 flights (virtually) as well for the STAR! Holds are actually very simple IMHO
What my real question is, is that do 727's feature any type of auto-flight? Like ALT HLD, or HDG HLD or are they totally manual?
1 other final point... Are the 340 and 727 being worked on at the same time or one before the other
Keep up the good work guys
01-05-2002, 02:01 PM
Great to here that Dave is onboard :) he is a great guy I meet him in Orlando for a nice tour of his office :)
Looking forward to this ultra realistic 727 down the road.
You guys are going to put me into a bid situation now.
Choosing between the 727 or the 737 when I fly in FS :D
Good thing I was able to pick up a UA 727 T&R and P&P manuals time to hit the books :)
01-05-2002, 02:43 PM
Lou ... you are a GENTLEMAN and A SCHOLAR ... a hidden GPS/NAV switch for us automation dependent people would be really wonderful ... but I will commit to learning to get by manually ... really ... looks like I need to do the "Rod Machado Tutorials" .. hehehe .. thanks!!! I will buy the 727 regardless
01-05-2002, 02:56 PM
You must be right - I had two seats for myself last time I was on an A340. ;-) Didn't have that on the 777.
The 777 is a tad faster though. :P
It's a lot like life and that's what's appealing (flight sim, that is)
01-05-2002, 02:58 PM
Thanks, Paul, and to answer a question above, essentially you have all the usual "holds" on the AP, such as ALT, HDG, NAV, APR, and the like. However, if I recall correctly, VS is controlled not with a digital readout, but simply by setting a thumbwheel that gives you the desired pitch to maintain a given VS referenced by the VSI. Frankly, I would probably just trim her for the climb, and then engage ALT hold once up there!
Since we'll have NAV hold, I think the least we can do is put in the NAV/GPS switch. I really have no problem with this.
The folks who want to fly with "ultra-automation" and FMCs to do all the flying for them all are probably not going to be buying the 727 anyway. So, we can have a little more fun here! ;-)
Actually Lou, what you're doing here should please most the people most the time (in an ideal world anyway) because the 727 will be "as is" from the factory to suit those of us who prefer little automation. Those who like lots of automation and glass can wait for the A340 and those who like to mix'n'match have an ideal bird already in the 734.
So, all tastes are gradually being catered for. Except mine of course. It all depends on my mood you see - sometimes I want glass, sometimes analogue. So I guess I'll have to buy all of them :)
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